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hello with the January 19 deadline for
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the US Tik Tok band fast approaching
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ordinary Americans have given the out of
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touch politicians in Washington a huge
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middle finger downloading another
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Chinese app Shia hongu on mass sending
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it to the number one spot on the US App
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Store American soft power has taken a
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massive hit so what is Shia will it be
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banned next and will the politicians on
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Capitol Hill come to regret biting off
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their nose to spite their face today I'm
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joined by special guest Professor War
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Powell to discuss this is reports on
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China AB bendy boham in Shanghai let's
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get
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[Music]
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reported for many in the US sh or little
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red book is the latest new Chinese app
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and they're downloading it in massive
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numbers in preparation for a possible
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Tik Tok ban later this week yesterday
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sha hongu surged to the top spot on the
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US App Store and Americans are now
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interacting directly with Chinese nison
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and calling themselves Tik Tock refugees
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but for Chinese nison sha hongu is
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nothing new the app was launched here in
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Shanghai back in
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2013 and today it has a massive user
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base of 300 million so here's some quick
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information Shong means Little Red Book
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in Chinese but contrary to popular
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belief that's not really a throwback to
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Chairman Ma's Little Red Book instead
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it's an analogy a place where users
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write notes about their travel plans
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restaurant choices shopping wish lists
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and so on of the 300 million users about
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70% are women half were born after
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1995 and 35% were born after the year
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2000
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half of its users come from China's top
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tier one and tier 2 cities and it's
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described by its creators as youthful
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and vibrant and a national lifestyle
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guide young Chinese who use the app will
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turn to it for recommendations when they
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go traveling when they want to try a new
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restaurant and to find out about the
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latest products on the market but here's
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the main point unlike Tik Tok Shia hongu
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is roughly 0% political in nature people
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don't discuss news or politics there and
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instead focus on shopping the latest
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trends and what's hot in Shanghai chungu
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and
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shinen there is not currently a US
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version of the app so these so-called
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Tik Tock refugees from the US are
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currently interacting with Chinese users
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in the Chinese
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ecosystem so I'm pretty sure that unless
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sha hongu quickly capitalizes on the
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surgeon North American uses those
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so-called Tik Tok refugees will soon get
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bored and will probably move on now I
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want to bring in today's special guest
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senior fellow at The tyur Institute
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Adjunct professor War pow from the
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Queensland University of Technology
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Professor welcome back to the show now
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firstly I want to just zoom out a little
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bit and talk about the tick tock
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situation which the US Supreme Court are
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currently considering before the
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deadline of January 19 which is later
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this week now the move to ban Tik Tok in
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the us is related uh to National
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Security concerns but it's hard to take
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that claim seriously considering the
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vast vast amount of frankly quite
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hilarious things Washington has deemed
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National Security threats over the past
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few years many of which um were featured
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on this show now I seem to remember
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Chinese coffee machines Chinese Port
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cranes Chinese Eves Chinese subway
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trains Chinese fridges Chinese students
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and even Chinese garlic has been under
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us suspicion what is going on here and
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why is the US paranoid about anything
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and everything that comes from
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China well the common theme across all
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of those Andy is that they're Chinese
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and I think that the that the problem
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we've got in the United States at the
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moment is that its political culture has
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rediscovered
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McCarthyism and has basically tied
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itself into some serious knots around
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this question of National Security a lot
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of this national security question
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relates to America's sense of diminished
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significance in the world World a form
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of displacement anxiety and it sees
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China as a peer competitor and it will
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do anything and everything that it can
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to try to stop the rise of China and for
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China to in the eyes of the Americans
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overtake the Americans position in the
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world the obsessions around National
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Security have become so extreme that
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they've securitized just about
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everything and once you've done that it
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literally means that um you know
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everything is a national security
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question but at the same time nothing is
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the only way that you can make sense of
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national security questions is is if
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you've got a la of focus on what
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actually constitutes National
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Security actually what your risks are
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and risks you've got to look at it in
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two aspects one is the probability that
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something um you know could be a threat
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genuinely and of course the extent to
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which it becomes a threat and what the
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consequences of that are and You' got to
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take a holistic View and a comprehensive
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view the Americans have um over the last
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few years I think reached a point where
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they're jumping at Shadows they're
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jumping at the things that they imagin
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themselves the monsters that are
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obviously keeping them um up at night
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and they've reached a point where it's
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starting to look very very
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silly yeah American users have
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downloaded another Chinese app sha hongu
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on M yesterday sending it to the top of
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the US App Store now this seems to me a
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bit like a hit to America's so-called
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soft power and it really shows not only
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how out of touch the politicians on
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Capitol Hill are um but that ordinary
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Americans are also getting quite sick of
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the state of Silicon Valley and its
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offerings what's your
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take look I think in a sense it's a
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large and growing group of American
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ordinary Americans who are trolling the
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federal government and the politicians
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which obviously has an irony towards all
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of it the app is not a direct um
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complimentary app to Tik Tok as many
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people obviously think um the most
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obvious compliment is on the Chinese
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version itself do Yin um but um but it
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is an interesting reaction from the
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American public that they are rejecting
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the politicization of what has largely
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been an entertainment and news sharing
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app and importantly an app that many
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Americans have used to create small
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businesses around so there's a lot of
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jobs that are going to be affected by
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um the prospective ban of Tik Tok itself
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and I think Americans actually
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understand what genuinely constitutes a
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risk intuitively at least and what
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things don't and clearly they're
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starting to vote with their swipes on
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the phone and uh looking to um maintain
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their relationships um with the with the
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Chinese world because they simply don't
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buy into the threat rhetoric that comes
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out of Washington
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DC yeah I love how you refer to it as a
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collective trolling of the folks on on
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Capitol Hill but if sha hongo does
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remain popular in the US and that's
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questionable do you think the
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politicians on Capitol Hill would Target
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it
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next naturally it's the natural response
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this is a cat and moue process now okay
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last question today Professor there's
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been some push back from president-
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elect Donald Trump and he's kind of
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pushing to hold off on the Tik Tok
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decision until he's in office now of
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course the Tik Tok deadline is January
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19 and he won't be inaugurated until the
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next day so what do you think the
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outcome of this Tik Tok case will be and
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what does this whole dearle kind of tell
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us about the us
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today well what it tells us about the US
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is that it's reached a stage of high
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paranoia and also in many regards a
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diminished confidence in its own ability
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to govern and regulate its own
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technological environment the idea that
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something like Tick Tock poses a quote
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security threat unquote really says
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something about Regulators views on the
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capabilities of American Technology
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Regulators to address these risks if it
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was an a manageable risk and you'd think
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that the United States has sufficiently
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skilled and clever people in these areas
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um then you wouldn't need to ban
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something but um but look the United
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States has reached a point of high
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paranoia and in fact High fast in that
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regard Donald Trump to his credit has
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been open to the possibilities of um
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recognizing that uh the Gap is not what
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the Biden Administration claims it to be
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and time will tell of course as to
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whether or not it simply becomes part of
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a
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negotiation um deck of cards that the
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incoming president will use as part of
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how he wants to re-engage with China how
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this plays out given the time gap
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between the 19th and his inauguration I
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guess will depend upon how the justices
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in the court um come to a view as to
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when it is that they might uh reach
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their judgments and deliver their
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judgments so um uh you know that's
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really in their hands and perhaps some
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phone calls to the justices um could
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lead them to require a few more days to
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think about what it is that uh that
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they're going to ultimately
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conclude very interesting Professor War
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pal thank you so much for sharing your
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thoughts today absolute pleasure to be
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with you again and on that note that
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will be it for today you guys but as
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always I'd love to hear your thoughts so
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do let me know Down Below have you
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downloaded sha and do you think Tik Tok
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will will be banned in the US
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also don't forget to hit like And
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subscribe if you haven't already it
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really does help the channel I'll see
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you next time bye-bye
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[Music]
