00:00:00
so is miraculous kind of sexist to
00:00:02
anybody else like yeah just a general
00:00:04
question and my goodness I know this is
00:00:07
already a bit of a spicy question to ask
00:00:09
and probably a spicy opinion to hold I
00:00:12
kind of think it is or at least I think
00:00:14
it sort of is in some regards now
00:00:16
obviously the intention behind the show
00:00:17
itself is largely uplifting and an
00:00:19
inspiring girl power type of story where
00:00:22
Marinette ladybug is the main hero of
00:00:24
the tale don't let the title fool you
00:00:26
this is not the tales of cat Noir it's
00:00:28
the tales of ladybug nobody's shortening
00:00:31
the title to miraculous cat Noir are
00:00:32
they they shorten it to miraculous
00:00:34
ladybug she's the main character and
00:00:36
that's all you need to know really it's
00:00:38
simply how the show's framed and on the
00:00:40
surface I think it actually does send
00:00:41
quite an empowering message right that
00:00:43
the hero doesn't always need to be a man
00:00:45
that girls can be independent and strong
00:00:47
and can lead and they get the job done
00:00:49
for themselves and through the vessel of
00:00:51
Marinette we do see this play out on
00:00:53
screen when we first meet her she's
00:00:55
rather Meek and scared and just not a
00:00:57
very heroic or exciting character at
00:00:59
least that that's what she's like at the
00:01:01
start of the timeline when you put those
00:01:02
episodes in chronological order but
00:01:04
after she's chosen by masterfood to
00:01:06
become the next winner of the miraculous
00:01:07
all because of her selfless kindness she
00:01:10
begins to develop far more as a
00:01:12
character she becomes self-confident a
00:01:15
self-assured hero she leads the duo to
00:01:17
Victory many times she's not the Damsel
00:01:19
in Distress she's not some weakling that
00:01:21
can't do anything right she's the one
00:01:23
that in the overwhelming majority of
00:01:25
episodes comes up with the winning
00:01:27
strategy that defeats the villain and
00:01:29
gets the Akuma and also in the majority
00:01:32
of the episode she's also just straight
00:01:33
up the person that does the most work
00:01:36
within the winning strategy whilst cat
00:01:38
Noir kind of awkwardly shuffles off to
00:01:39
the side or gets defeated you know as is
00:01:42
tradition on top of that over the course
00:01:44
of the show it's Marinette that's chosen
00:01:46
to be trained by Foo and set up to be
00:01:48
the future Guardian to replace him at
00:01:50
the end of season three and it's her
00:01:52
that leads the team of Heroes she's in
00:01:54
charge she's trusted to know all of the
00:01:56
identities except for cat noirs and hand
00:01:59
out the miraculous to whom she will and
00:02:01
really she's just the main leader in the
00:02:03
effort to defeat hawkmoth or Shadow moth
00:02:05
or Monarch whatever you want to call him
00:02:06
old smooth brain Gabe himself and so
00:02:09
yeah in that regard I do think the show
00:02:11
was a bit of a breath of fresh air a new
00:02:13
era so to speak a bit more Progressive
00:02:15
than some shows have been in the past
00:02:17
but that's just the obvious thing right
00:02:19
oh yes the girl is the main hero it's a
00:02:21
step in the right direction but at the
00:02:23
same time the show for me at least still
00:02:26
comes across as really sus when you
00:02:28
compare it to a bunch of other shows of
00:02:29
this era and indeed past eras and there
00:02:32
are a few ways in which I've noticed
00:02:33
this but for starters we can start with
00:02:35
the hyper fixation on romance or rather
00:02:37
the hyper fixation of the story to have
00:02:39
all the main lead girls just thirst over
00:02:42
this one dude driving most of the drama
00:02:44
and the story development and this is
00:02:46
pretty much the exclusion of all else
00:02:48
and so yes I'm talking about the thirst
00:02:50
for Adrian because when you think about
00:02:52
Marinette what is the main goal in her
00:02:54
life that comes to mind that you see
00:02:56
across all of the seasons of the show
00:02:58
and if you've not said managed to win in
00:03:00
Adrian's heart then I'm sorry you are
00:03:02
the weakest link goodbye pretty much
00:03:04
every episode you'll ever see you'll
00:03:06
have this Force its way into the story
00:03:07
in some regard and it never really
00:03:09
changes even when she dates Luca it's
00:03:12
very brief and then she's just back at
00:03:14
it again her whole identity changes she
00:03:16
goes from the self-assured leader of her
00:03:18
friend group to a complete creepazoid
00:03:21
and with a flip of a coin pretty much
00:03:23
her whole identity revolves around this
00:03:25
one dude and if you strip it away she no
00:03:28
longer has any real story Beyond
00:03:30
fighting Gabe which is not enough if you
00:03:32
ask me for a well-rounded character let
00:03:35
alone you protagonist even her
00:03:37
interactions with her friends over time
00:03:38
largely become colored by this Obsession
00:03:41
all of their schemes and their
00:03:43
discussions to try and get her in with
00:03:45
Adrian it's fine for a sometimes
00:03:47
storyline as I know real friendships do
00:03:50
have these sort of discussions but like
00:03:51
it's such a dominant force in the story
00:03:53
that I do think it actually actively
00:03:55
harms Marinette as a character or at
00:03:58
least it did in early Seasons especially
00:04:00
it makes her whole Arc dependent on this
00:04:03
one guy which doesn't feel very
00:04:05
Progressive to me I mean I'm not against
00:04:07
romance and I do think it has a place in
00:04:09
the story but the way it's framed is
00:04:11
just very odd to me I mean it even
00:04:13
spills over into a number of the other
00:04:15
main characters and their relationships
00:04:18
with Marinette our main hero take Lila
00:04:20
for example she's pretty much being set
00:04:22
up as the main villain of the show's
00:04:23
next big Saga she's replacing Gabe and
00:04:26
she's getting her hands on the
00:04:27
miraculous of the butterfly and so
00:04:29
clearly she needed a reason to go up
00:04:31
against Marinette it just makes sense to
00:04:32
have them at odds right to build up this
00:04:34
rivalry whilst you can before Lila goes
00:04:37
off through Hawk moth and kind of has to
00:04:39
be in the shadows by necessity and how
00:04:41
is it do you think they built up this
00:04:42
Grand rivalry how do you think they did
00:04:44
it that's right they had Marinette get
00:04:47
massively and irrationally jealous at
00:04:49
Lila trying to crack onto Adrian that's
00:04:51
how that is the entire story of why they
00:04:54
hate each other what will turn out to be
00:04:56
a multi-season clash between these two
00:04:58
characters boils down into an attempted
00:05:00
tug of war over Adrian's affections
00:05:02
which oh I don't know it kind of worked
00:05:05
at First until it basically just
00:05:06
consumed their whole storyline even
00:05:08
beyond the point of reason because after
00:05:10
Adrian has given Lila the proverbial
00:05:13
middle finger she's still trying to
00:05:14
manipulate her way in to getting with
00:05:17
this dude she pretty much swears a blood
00:05:18
Feud against Marinette for all time
00:05:20
because she was blocked that one
00:05:22
time like she straight up tries to ruin
00:05:24
this girl's life same with Chloe yeah
00:05:26
there's the pre-built history with Chloe
00:05:28
and Marinette but the reality that in
00:05:31
practice many of their conflicts simply
00:05:33
boil down to jealousy and competition
00:05:35
About a Boy even late into the game
00:05:37
where once again Adrian has told Chloe
00:05:39
where to shove it she's still trying to
00:05:41
get in she's still trying to manipulate
00:05:43
him to get him away from Marinette and I
00:05:45
don't know I do think it makes him seem
00:05:47
like weaker characters it feels lazy and
00:05:50
contrived in falling into a lot of those
00:05:52
old tropes that we probably want to get
00:05:53
away from I mean I don't think they're
00:05:55
overtly trying to be sexist or
00:05:56
misogynistic or anything like that but
00:05:58
it certainly seems quite regressive live
00:06:00
to have so many of the prominent female
00:06:02
cast members your main protagonist two
00:06:04
of your major antagonists Al kagami's
00:06:07
whole vibe was about Adrian and then she
00:06:09
switches to Felix who conveniently looks
00:06:11
exactly like Adrian but yeah they become
00:06:13
rabid dogs when they're confronted with
00:06:15
this handsome boy they lose all sense of
00:06:17
character and they fight it out a bunch
00:06:19
of animals trying to get the last link
00:06:20
of sausages it's especially hard to take
00:06:22
Marinette your main protagonist
00:06:24
seriously as a result of all this her
00:06:27
thirsty Shenanigans go way too far and
00:06:29
it becomes weird and the problem is it's
00:06:32
not a reciprocal thing take a look at
00:06:34
Adrian in his storyline yes obviously
00:06:36
there's still the obsession with ladybug
00:06:37
and all of that but it's not in the same
00:06:39
way it's much reduced and it doesn't
00:06:42
Define his relationships with pretty
00:06:43
much every other character because there
00:06:45
are major facets to historian
00:06:47
personality and interpersonal
00:06:48
relationships that develop independently
00:06:51
of ladybug like his friendships with the
00:06:53
various Side characters kagami Luca Nino
00:06:56
his bond with plague Natalie being a
00:06:59
surrogate mother foreign his stormy and
00:07:01
abusive relationship with Gabe and all
00:07:02
that entails hell even the development
00:07:05
of his relationship with Marinette
00:07:06
because like I said that's a new thing
00:07:09
he doesn't know that marinette's ladybug
00:07:11
so it's a different relationship and
00:07:13
that for him from his point of view
00:07:15
develops naturally and healthily and
00:07:17
only after that does that all twist
00:07:19
together his story develops into it it's
00:07:21
not the only facet of his personality
00:07:24
that is so much depth he's a character
00:07:26
that does not live solely to play out
00:07:28
his obsession with his romantic interest
00:07:29
and instead he has much more of a life
00:07:31
and personality outside of that it's
00:07:33
just the difference in the way that the
00:07:35
story deals with both their arcs that I
00:07:37
do find really astounding and really
00:07:39
regressive oh and on top of that can I
00:07:42
remind anybody how they frame the
00:07:44
rejection of cat Noir by ladybug over
00:07:46
and over again how that's treated by the
00:07:48
story is treated as a massive negative
00:07:50
plague yells at ladybug about it saying
00:07:52
that she should be grateful for having
00:07:54
someone love her so much the sad music
00:07:56
playing over and over again every time
00:07:58
he's rejected and gets sad Captain wants
00:07:59
gets angsty ladybug apologizes for
00:08:03
hurting his feelings imagine that the
00:08:05
rejected man who can't accept a no is
00:08:07
treated by The Narrative by the story by
00:08:10
the writers as the victim whilst the
00:08:12
woman who does the right thing and tells
00:08:13
him no and won't accept his romantic
00:08:15
affection and all the while makes it
00:08:17
very clear to him that she's not trying
00:08:19
to lead him on before exercising her
00:08:21
right to feel safe and avoid his overly
00:08:23
creepy ways is considered to be a shrew
00:08:26
to be cruel a heartbreaker that's
00:08:30
straight out of the Nice Guy's subreddit
00:08:31
but that's not all and I would argue
00:08:34
that this next one is probably the worst
00:08:35
of it it's how the show frames the arcs
00:08:37
of his villains and the different way it
00:08:39
wants you to view villainous male
00:08:40
characters versus villainous female
00:08:42
characters look Gabe's a massive piece
00:08:45
of and you can't possibly try to
00:08:47
deny that fact it's just how it is he
00:08:49
abuses his son and random other children
00:08:52
and really anyone and is willing to
00:08:54
sacrifice everybody in the world and
00:08:56
anything in the world in pursuit of his
00:08:58
selfish desire of bringing him his wife
00:09:00
back to life even though on real talk
00:09:02
let's be honest she played with who I
00:09:04
actually got burned that was the price
00:09:05
she paid to have a kid too bad and it
00:09:07
was one that she actually seemed to have
00:09:09
long since accepted so he goes against
00:09:11
her dying wishes and he does heinous
00:09:13
to her only child but at the last
00:09:15
second he changes his mind and decides
00:09:16
to be a good person like he gets a
00:09:18
literal last second Redemption and then
00:09:21
he's remembered as a tragic hero what
00:09:24
he's a piece of trash but the show is
00:09:27
framing him as a hero at the end what
00:09:29
next up look at Andre he's also up there
00:09:32
for worst father in the franchise he
00:09:34
bows down to the every whim of his
00:09:35
abusive and narcissistic wife allowing
00:09:37
his daughter to become just as twisted
00:09:39
and indeed he engages in a ton of
00:09:42
shady and corrupt dealings himself and
00:09:44
at the end of all of that he ditches his
00:09:46
daughter whom he mostly raised himself
00:09:48
and considers her a lost cause with the
00:09:51
show suddenly painting this dude as a
00:09:53
victim and a hero for letting Chloe have
00:09:55
it for tearing her apart verbally and
00:09:58
abandoning her to be raised by his wife
00:10:00
his truly terrible horrible abusive wife
00:10:03
sure yeah I guess he's a hero then isn't
00:10:06
he so now we have two undeserved I'd
00:10:08
argue Redemption asks for the major male
00:10:11
antagonists well just another comparison
00:10:14
Felix in his intro does he not assault
00:10:17
Marinette or at least harass her quite
00:10:19
badly that ain't good and he Slaughters
00:10:21
the entire planet because he has daddy
00:10:23
issues and existential issues but at no
00:10:26
point beyond that brief intro do I think
00:10:29
this story ever really frames him as a
00:10:31
villain no he's an anti-hero a bit of a
00:10:34
badass who yeah he makes some mistakes
00:10:36
but it's all good because he's a soft
00:10:38
boy at heart and he gets done come
00:10:42
on now but what about the ladies what do
00:10:44
they get any redemption in sight well we
00:10:46
have Natalie and she does get a pretty
00:10:48
good Redemption Arc this one that
00:10:50
actually feels the most earned because
00:10:52
she doesn't just suddenly get the
00:10:54
Redemption Arc out of nowhere she gets
00:10:56
sick trying to help Gabe because I think
00:10:58
on one hand she loves him two on one
00:11:00
hand she was very close to Emily and
00:11:02
three she loves Adrian so much and wants
00:11:05
him to have his mother back but then she
00:11:07
gets sick she see Gabe's going crazy and
00:11:09
then he's abusing Adrian way too hard
00:11:10
and so she tries to change things decent
00:11:14
enough well written I think but then who
00:11:16
are our other female villains three
00:11:18
truly terrible characters who show No
00:11:21
Remorse at all no goodness and by the
00:11:23
end there's no real positive qualities
00:11:25
we're talking Chloe we're talking Lila
00:11:27
we're talking Audrey Audrey especially
00:11:30
is blamed for everything that Andre has
00:11:33
ever done obviously she must have lured
00:11:35
the poor innocent man in with her
00:11:36
terrible womanly wiles and corrupted him
00:11:39
making him give up on his filmmaking
00:11:41
dreams to become a businessman and a
00:11:43
politician it really is like some made
00:11:45
up red pill Reddit storyline on top of
00:11:48
that she has an affair baby whom Saint
00:11:50
Andre adopts at the end out of nowhere
00:11:53
yikes so she's just the worst piece of
00:11:56
shitty trash a terrible woman the worst
00:11:58
one imaginable No Redemption No Remorse
00:12:01
no positive qualities at all just rage
00:12:03
and hate and cruelty and he is our
00:12:05
little cream puff sweetheart who was led
00:12:08
astray by the power of Snooze new cringe
00:12:10
and then there's Lila who's being set up
00:12:12
to be the next big villain to replace
00:12:14
Gabe and I would be very shocked based
00:12:16
on the trajectory of her character if
00:12:18
she ever gets the same treatment Escape
00:12:19
where the writers try to make you
00:12:21
understand the point of view that she
00:12:23
has and then give a bit of a positive
00:12:24
spin on them from time to time like Gabe
00:12:27
and his pancakes Arc and the fact that
00:12:29
he really does love his wife and does
00:12:31
love his son to some extent and then we
00:12:33
move on to the Arc of Chloe Who develops
00:12:35
over the early Seasons into a sort of
00:12:37
hero only to regress and regress really
00:12:40
hard and become even worse than she ever
00:12:42
was before and then on top of that they
00:12:43
add new new flashback episodes that
00:12:46
paint her as even worse than she was in
00:12:48
season one through three so she goes
00:12:50
from entitled bully to raging
00:12:53
Audrey Jr in every single way her
00:12:55
sympathetic relationship with her
00:12:56
abusive mum it's washed away because now
00:12:59
she's simply always been an awful person
00:13:01
and then she gets that extreme Cosmic
00:13:04
punishment from on high as she loses
00:13:06
everything her only friends her home her
00:13:09
father's love all of it feels like the
00:13:11
writers are getting some sort of sick
00:13:13
gratification out of writing the
00:13:15
breakdown of a teenage girl it's a yikes
00:13:17
from me dog but no I very much doubt
00:13:20
they're going to give her the last
00:13:21
second Redemption where she apologizes
00:13:23
and realize she was wrong she's gonna go
00:13:24
down with no regrets the only reason she
00:13:27
might be remorseful is that she didn't
00:13:29
manage to destroy marinette's life and
00:13:31
that's not to mention kagami's mum who
00:13:34
seems good for now right oh she's had a
00:13:36
Redemption but she's doing all this good
00:13:38
stuff no she came across as really
00:13:40
terrible in the show and it's very
00:13:42
obvious she's being set up to do some
00:13:43
more terrible once the story
00:13:45
continues her out of the blue change of
00:13:47
heart very much feels like and
00:13:49
I doubt there's going to be the same
00:13:50
level of sympathy that's applied to her
00:13:52
story as games either I'm happy to be
00:13:54
wrong but I'm not convinced I mean
00:13:57
yeah it's not necessarily bad riding
00:13:59
right it's pretty generic in 2D at times
00:14:02
but it wouldn't bother me if it was
00:14:04
consistent if Gabe and Andre and Felix
00:14:08
they were all treated as badly as these
00:14:10
ladies are but they aren't they get to
00:14:13
change they get people to trust them
00:14:15
they get people to believe in them
00:14:17
whereas the opposite is not true for the
00:14:19
female characters and to me it just
00:14:21
plays into so many bad tropes that I do
00:14:24
not think have a place in a show that
00:14:25
aims to empower young girls EG that
00:14:28
abusive men which all three of these
00:14:30
guys are to some extent can be fixed or
00:14:34
misunderstood and need guidance and can
00:14:36
earn Redemption because under it all
00:14:38
they're just soft boys who need love
00:14:40
yikes no thanks and meanwhile bad women
00:14:45
they're the source of all evil we need
00:14:47
to burn them at the stake we need to see
00:14:49
their lives fall apart in great detail
00:14:51
we need the karmic Justice to slap these
00:14:54
in the face no mercy no
00:14:57
forgiveness yikes yikes yikes red flags
00:15:00
everywhere no thank you and so yeah
00:15:03
that's all I've got for you today so
00:15:05
with all that being said I think I'll
00:15:07
leave things here and say these have
00:15:08
been my opinions and now I'd like to
00:15:10
hear yours what do you think about all
00:15:11
this do you agree with me disagree am I
00:15:14
reading too much into things I'm really
00:15:16
curious for your thoughts so make sure
00:15:17
to like comment subscribe and let me
00:15:19
know
