Web3 Brand Loyalty with Kalder’s Founder Gökçe Güven | Web3 Watch Fireside Chat

00:50:23
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0eaSxrXkr4

概要

TLDRDas Gespräch zwischen Chrissy und Carlos behandelt die Integration von Web3-Technologien in traditionelle Marketingstrategien, um die Markentreue zu steigern. Dabei betont Carlos, dass Web3 es ermöglicht, direkte und tiefere Beziehungen zwischen Marken und Kunden zu schaffen, indem es die traditionellen Barrieren beseitigt. Er argumentiert, dass Blockchain-Technologie genutzt werden kann, um dynamische NFTs als Belohnungssysteme zu schaffen, die nicht nur wiederholte Käufe, sondern auch das gesamte Kundenengagement verfolgen und belohnen. Die Diskussion geht auch auf die Herausforderungen ein, die Marken im Web2-Umfeld haben, einschließlich hoher Werbekosten und des Verlusts an direkter Kundeninteraktion. Weitere Punkte umfassen die technischen Herausforderungen bei der Integration von Web3, die Bedeutung von Kunden als Mitgestalter und die Revolution in der Datennutzung, die Web3 ermöglichen kann.

収穫

  • 👩‍💻 Web3 eröffnet neue Wege für das Kundenengagement.
  • 🏷️ NFTs können als dynamische Mitgliedschaften genutzt werden.
  • 📊 Blockchain bietet transparente und sichere Datenströme.
  • 💡 Marken können direkte Beziehungen zu ihren Kunden aufbauen.
  • 🚀 Web3 reduziert die Abhängigkeit von zentralisierten Plattformen.
  • 🔍 Markendaten können zur Entwicklung von Engagement-Strategien genutzt werden.
  • 🧩 Kunden werden als Mitgestalter und Influencer betrachtet.
  • 🌐 Herausforderungen bei der mobilen Integration von Web3.
  • 🎯 Kundenbindung soll durch bedeutungsvolle Engagements gestärkt werden.
  • 🔗 Zusammenarbeit zwischen Marken könnte durch Web3 erleichtert werden.

タイムライン

  • 00:00:00 - 00:05:00

    Chrissy interviewt Carlos über Markentreue im Web 3. Carlos erzählt von seinem Hintergrund in der Krypto-Technologie und den Anfängen bei Unternehmen wie Celo und Opensea, die ihn inspirierten, Grenzen zwischen Marken und Technologie zu überwinden.

  • 00:05:00 - 00:10:00

    Marken stehen vor Herausforderungen durch steigende Kosten alter Marketingkanäle und suchen nach Web3-Lösungen für langfristige Kundenbeziehungen. Carlos hebt die Wichtigkeit der Integration von Web3 als Kernstück für tägliches Marketing hervor.

  • 00:10:00 - 00:15:00

    Es gibt zwei wesentliche Bedürfnisse von Marken: neue Tools für Community-Engagement und der Zugang zu direkten Kundendaten. Das Ende von Drittanbieter-Cookies erhöht den Fokus auf eigene Datenstrategien, um Kosten zu senken und Kundenbindung zu stärken.

  • 00:15:00 - 00:20:00

    Web3 bietet neue Möglichkeiten, indem es den Wert von Kundeninteraktionen durch On-Chain-Daten steigert. Die Möglichkeit, Kundenbewegungen direkt nachzuverfolgen und Engagement zu analysieren, schafft eine neue Dimension im Kundendatenmanagement.

  • 00:20:00 - 00:25:00

    Das Potential von Web3 liegt in der Verbindung von realer und digitaler Welt. Loyalty-Programme können durch dynamische NFTs revolutioniert werden, die Kunden durch Interaktionen unterschiedliche Vorteile bieten. Traditionelle Markenprogramme sind im Umbruch.

  • 00:25:00 - 00:30:00

    Dynamische NFTs verändern die Art der Kundenbelohnung. Sie ermöglichen, dass Engagement und Loyalität durch Echtzeitdaten sichtbar werden, was die Kundenbindung intensiviert und eine flexible Anpassung an Kundenverhalten ermöglicht.

  • 00:30:00 - 00:35:00

    Marken und Marketer können Blockchain-Daten nutzen, um präzisere und direktere Einblicke in Kundenverhalten zu gewinnen. Die Fähigkeit, Impressions und Kundenbewegungen zu analysieren, bietet eine neue Dimension der Marktsegmentierung.

  • 00:35:00 - 00:40:00

    Web3 verändert die Wettbewerbslandschaft, indem Marken durch Partnerschaften stärkeren Zugang zu Kundendaten erhalten. Das führt zu präziseren und kollaborativeren Markenstrategien, die den Kundenmehrwert maximieren.

  • 00:40:00 - 00:45:00

    Ein nahtloser Übergang von Web2 zu Web3 erfordert mobile Integration und benutzerfreundliche Schnittstellen. Trotz technischer Herausforderungen bleiben Fortschritte in der mobilen Benutzerfreundlichkeit entscheidend für die Akzeptanz.

  • 00:45:00 - 00:50:23

    Aufbau einer langfristigen Web3-Strategie erfordert Überdenken klassischer Marketingansätze. Marken, die erfolgreich Communitys aufbauen und stärken, werden Vorreiter im sich wandelnden digitalen Marketingumfeld sein.

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マインドマップ

ビデオQ&A

  • Was ist der Zweck des Costac-Projekts?

    Das Costac-Projekt zielt darauf ab, Web3-Technologien in traditionelle Marketingstrategien zu integrieren.

  • Was ist die zentrale These der Diskussion über Markentreue?

    Web3-Technologien können genutzt werden, um eine tiefere Beziehung zwischen Marken und ihren Kunden zu schaffen, indem Barrieren beseitigt werden und direkte Engagement-Möglichkeiten entstehen.

  • Welche Herausforderungen sehen Marken im Web 2.0-Marketing?

    Marken sehen sich mit hohen Kosten für Werbung und einem Mangel an direkter Kundenbindung konfrontiert.

  • Wie können NFTs im Web3-Marketing genutzt werden?

    NFTs können als dynamische Mitgliedschaften und Belohnungssysteme genutzt werden, um Kundenengagement und Loyalität zu fördern.

  • Warum ist die Nutzung von Blockchain im Marketing vorteilhaft?

    Blockchain bietet transparente und sichere Datenströme und ermöglicht es Marken, direkte Beziehungen zu ihren Kunden aufzubauen.

  • Was sind die Vorteile von Web3 gegenüber traditionellen Werbeplattformen wie Google und Facebook?

    Web3 ermöglicht es Marken, direkt mit ihren Kunden zu interagieren und die Abhängigkeit von zentralisierten Plattformen zu reduzieren.

  • Wie sieht die Zukunft der Marken im Web 3.0 aus?

    Kunden werden nicht nur als Konsumenten, sondern als Mitgestalter und Influencer betrachtet.

  • Wie sollen Markendaten im Web3-Kontext genutzt werden?

    Marken sollen öffentliche Blockchain-Daten nutzen, um Engagement-Strategien zu entwickeln.

  • Welche technischen Herausforderungen bestehen bei der Implementierung von Web3-Marketing-Tools?

    Es gibt Herausforderungen bei der mobilen Nutzung und der Integration von Blockchain-Technologie in bestehende Systeme.

  • Welche Rolle spielt die Kundenbindung im Web3-Marketing?

    Kundenbindung ist zentral und soll durch interaktive und bedeutungsvolle Engagements verbessert werden.

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  • 00:00:00
    [Music]
  • 00:00:03
    hello I'm Chrissy the founding director
  • 00:00:05
    of the costac project coming to you from
  • 00:00:07
    the land of web 3. today I'm joined by
  • 00:00:09
    Carlos founder Dolce uh who's going to
  • 00:00:12
    talk about a brand loyalty in web 3
  • 00:00:14
    using web3 stack to rethink marketing
  • 00:00:17
    brand relationship and um most
  • 00:00:19
    importantly having an intimate and
  • 00:00:21
    growing relationship with customers
  • 00:00:22
    thank you for joining us thank you Chris
  • 00:00:25
    it's great to be here and I've always
  • 00:00:28
    been a follower of card stocks podcast
  • 00:00:29
    so excited Deep dive into brand loyalty
  • 00:00:33
    marketing and the future of Brands 3.0
  • 00:00:35
    absolutely I think when we talk about
  • 00:00:37
    web 3 marketing a lot of people think
  • 00:00:39
    about like Shilling or like talking
  • 00:00:41
    about the future possibility but
  • 00:00:43
    Marketing in the traditional world is
  • 00:00:45
    really a kind of a science and they're
  • 00:00:47
    not in science about data about
  • 00:00:48
    engagement about deeping that
  • 00:00:50
    relationship uh what makes you kind of
  • 00:00:53
    uh bring those two Fields together right
  • 00:00:54
    like true Marketing in the digital
  • 00:00:56
    marketing maybe even brand marketing
  • 00:00:58
    sense and the two set of the emerging
  • 00:01:01
    and uh and refining two set of web three
  • 00:01:04
    what brings you to that intersection
  • 00:01:05
    yeah that's a great question and your
  • 00:01:08
    spot on that marketing has always been
  • 00:01:10
    one way but uh has been data driven
  • 00:01:13
    about how do you bring and upsell from
  • 00:01:17
    the Journey of the starting point of the
  • 00:01:19
    customer through the different
  • 00:01:20
    intersections and different engagement
  • 00:01:22
    rails and when it comes to my story I
  • 00:01:26
    have always been in the intersection of
  • 00:01:27
    Brands marketing and Engineering I have
  • 00:01:30
    what I call a day job and a night job
  • 00:01:33
    and my day job has always been crypto
  • 00:01:35
    engine nearing and I started in 2017 and
  • 00:01:39
    18 era and went down in the rabbit hole
  • 00:01:41
    in crypto and back then it was only
  • 00:01:44
    layer ones and wallets so at cello I was
  • 00:01:47
    part of the early stage organization and
  • 00:01:49
    the foundation that worked on the wallet
  • 00:01:52
    before pre-made like pre-made net times
  • 00:01:54
    and was able to see how we need to build
  • 00:01:58
    a consumer phase like consumer facing
  • 00:02:00
    right applications to bring next billion
  • 00:02:02
    people on chain and then I was part I
  • 00:02:06
    hacked on different D5 and like nft
  • 00:02:09
    projects back in 2019 with like
  • 00:02:12
    blockchain at Berkeley uh jumped into
  • 00:02:14
    Robinwood cryptos early like crypto team
  • 00:02:17
    and lastly and most importantly these uh
  • 00:02:21
    Two Worlds collided when I joined openc
  • 00:02:24
    and I was part of the early product and
  • 00:02:26
    design team seeing how consumers Brands
  • 00:02:30
    and Enterprises started to engage
  • 00:02:33
    directly by passing middleman's like
  • 00:02:35
    Instagram or like Amazon and start to
  • 00:02:38
    own data and engagement with their
  • 00:02:41
    community and what I say my night job
  • 00:02:44
    was always about fashion brands and
  • 00:02:47
    marketing I um have a sister who has
  • 00:02:50
    been collecting Vogues when since I'm
  • 00:02:53
    seven and I think that was a pivotal
  • 00:02:55
    time for me where I actually had a time
  • 00:02:58
    in my life where I studied for a year in
  • 00:03:00
    like St Martin's and the fashion and
  • 00:03:02
    engagement and marketing and seeing the
  • 00:03:05
    two sides of the world and the past year
  • 00:03:08
    was pivotal and such that I had a lot of
  • 00:03:10
    Brands I was working with that wanted to
  • 00:03:13
    get into crypto and we've seen for the
  • 00:03:16
    first time that crossing the chasm but
  • 00:03:18
    there was no right person or product
  • 00:03:20
    that brings Brands and crypto
  • 00:03:23
    Engineering in the right intersection
  • 00:03:25
    and build the right tools knowing both
  • 00:03:28
    sides of the world so that's where I
  • 00:03:30
    came in and Calvin came to life that
  • 00:03:33
    makes a lot of sense and how big do
  • 00:03:35
    things again like when you're talking to
  • 00:03:37
    brand and they hear about web3 in the
  • 00:03:39
    mainstream press or dabble a little bit
  • 00:03:41
    in the uh kind of the rabbit hole what
  • 00:03:44
    understanding do they have and what
  • 00:03:46
    Instinct do they come with and what are
  • 00:03:48
    the surprises they they discover when
  • 00:03:50
    they talk to you uh what what was that
  • 00:03:52
    Enlightenment moment look like yeah
  • 00:03:54
    definitely and as we have seen a lot of
  • 00:03:57
    brands are excited to learn more about
  • 00:04:00
    nfts and web 3 but with the last years
  • 00:04:03
    like bubble and Trends but yet we are
  • 00:04:07
    still so early in the market that when a
  • 00:04:10
    lot of Brands come in to launch nfts
  • 00:04:12
    they don't know what is the potential
  • 00:04:15
    with blockchain technology they think
  • 00:04:17
    it's um 10 000 derivations of jpegs but
  • 00:04:21
    yet what blockchain is technology is
  • 00:04:24
    um the best for is creating direct
  • 00:04:27
    bottom-up engagement with community and
  • 00:04:30
    um creating better data streams and many
  • 00:04:32
    more so in what it best starts with is
  • 00:04:36
    essentially breaking down the
  • 00:04:39
    misconceptions and breaking down the
  • 00:04:42
    terminology so and focusing on the
  • 00:04:44
    problem what we have seen that actually
  • 00:04:47
    crypto projects on the well is solving
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    problems of Brands but rather show
  • 00:04:53
    marketing projects so uh what we focus
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    on when we work with Brands and onboard
  • 00:04:58
    them to our self-serve tools is that
  • 00:05:00
    their existing marketing channels are
  • 00:05:03
    actively deteriorating and existing
  • 00:05:05
    tools are getting costly d2c ads are not
  • 00:05:08
    adding up third-party cookies are
  • 00:05:10
    shutting down there's so many Paradigm
  • 00:05:12
    shifts in marketing that we can solve
  • 00:05:14
    with web3 powered uh like loyalty tools
  • 00:05:18
    and that's what we index on solving The
  • 00:05:21
    Real World engagement problems and then
  • 00:05:22
    that's how brands are like wow I really
  • 00:05:25
    need this as a core marketing primitive
  • 00:05:27
    not one-off drops and that's where we
  • 00:05:30
    want to like shift the Paradigm to
  • 00:05:32
    Bringing web 3 rails as a core marketing
  • 00:05:35
    primitive every Brand's day-to-day
  • 00:05:37
    engagement absolutely and I think it's
  • 00:05:39
    really important to note that when you
  • 00:05:41
    talk to let's call them web 2 marketer
  • 00:05:43
    is that the deterioration of the
  • 00:05:46
    marketing stack in web 2 with the uh do
  • 00:05:49
    not track initiative with uh even the
  • 00:05:51
    the extraction the Facebook and Google
  • 00:05:53
    take on top of the marketing we spend
  • 00:05:55
    most of the money is going to two
  • 00:05:56
    companies and and supporting the
  • 00:05:58
    metaverse initiative and other alphabets
  • 00:06:01
    and it's not working for Brands it
  • 00:06:04
    really isn't and it has really actively
  • 00:06:05
    deteriorated so it's not like a nice to
  • 00:06:07
    have because it's like oh my new
  • 00:06:09
    apartment is not ready but my old
  • 00:06:11
    apartment is in underwater right people
  • 00:06:13
    don't realize how dire the situation is
  • 00:06:16
    are they looking for some Refuge or they
  • 00:06:19
    don't really have uh the recognition
  • 00:06:21
    that the ship is thinking what is the
  • 00:06:23
    what is the term what is the sentiment
  • 00:06:25
    yeah that is a great question and like
  • 00:06:27
    every brand we work with especially
  • 00:06:29
    bigger the size more um the urgency is
  • 00:06:32
    asking us for two things one what is the
  • 00:06:35
    next generation in advocacy or Community
  • 00:06:37
    tooling what is the next Generation data
  • 00:06:41
    tooling because just like what you said
  • 00:06:43
    like I'm like Amazon ads Google ads
  • 00:06:45
    every every big company is now uh
  • 00:06:49
    building even bigger walled Gardens to
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    uh own and not share the data of
  • 00:06:56
    customers and um as more like as data
  • 00:07:00
    and access to this data gets more
  • 00:07:02
    expensive and centralized every brand
  • 00:07:04
    knows that they need to bring the
  • 00:07:06
    customer back to their website and own
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    the engagement so we see that like as
  • 00:07:12
    the red flags and urgency is already
  • 00:07:14
    there especially the year like about to
  • 00:07:17
    close up because uh 2023 will be pivotal
  • 00:07:21
    in third-party cookies changes and what
  • 00:07:25
    we have seen is companies without first
  • 00:07:28
    party data are actually going to spend
  • 00:07:30
    20 more on marketing efforts to make up
  • 00:07:33
    for loss of cookies so with the new
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    changes implemented every brand will
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    prioritize first party engagement and
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    data as their marketing initiative and
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    put it as part of their budget
  • 00:07:47
    yeah you know when musicians talk about
  • 00:07:49
    nft they always talk about cutting out
  • 00:07:51
    Spotify and that middleman so this idea
  • 00:07:54
    that and I kind of want to understand a
  • 00:07:56
    little bit about you know your spin on
  • 00:07:58
    the web 3 loyalty brand loyalty solution
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    stack I think we understand what the
  • 00:08:01
    problem says but there's also a lot of
  • 00:08:03
    interesting possibility space within the
  • 00:08:05
    public data of of transaction history
  • 00:08:08
    the the user nft is a type of signal of
  • 00:08:11
    status and loyalty uh can you tell us a
  • 00:08:14
    little bit about like what is the kind
  • 00:08:16
    of uh solution bundle if the problem is
  • 00:08:19
    well known and the infomercial but like
  • 00:08:21
    don't you hate it when you cannot track
  • 00:08:22
    your customer and give them the the
  • 00:08:24
    value they want and giving all the the
  • 00:08:26
    value to a few big Tech Giants what is
  • 00:08:29
    the solution set that you you believe is
  • 00:08:31
    the building block for this new web free
  • 00:08:33
    marketing solution yeah that's a great
  • 00:08:35
    question so what we have seen after
  • 00:08:38
    years of working with like Brands and in
  • 00:08:41
    the intersection of crypto is Brands
  • 00:08:43
    don't need one scope solution but the
  • 00:08:46
    full stack a customer relationship
  • 00:08:48
    management to engage and segment their
  • 00:08:51
    uh customers so how counter looks like
  • 00:08:54
    today is that we provide the full white
  • 00:08:58
    label service for Brands to establish
  • 00:09:00
    their tiered Dynamic nft memberships
  • 00:09:03
    launch their own brand native rewards
  • 00:09:06
    like I think about Nike Starbucks like
  • 00:09:09
    Adidas and having their full native
  • 00:09:12
    rewards that looks like a full reward
  • 00:09:14
    system but is just ended up being
  • 00:09:16
    powered by blockchain technology so it's
  • 00:09:19
    super seamless but uh is using web 3
  • 00:09:21
    rails and lastly create what we call
  • 00:09:25
    contribute to earn experiences where
  • 00:09:28
    Brands can set and gamify and tokenize
  • 00:09:31
    any task or engagement that they want
  • 00:09:34
    come Community to do or activate with
  • 00:09:38
    and what happens when you put these
  • 00:09:41
    features on blockchain Rails is couple
  • 00:09:44
    things one you create a tiered product
  • 00:09:47
    and experience access with Dynamic nft
  • 00:09:50
    memberships where where essentially nfts
  • 00:09:53
    become the gateway to these new brand
  • 00:09:55
    worlds and communities and you change
  • 00:09:58
    customers into a community and two what
  • 00:10:02
    loyalty has done wrong and never went
  • 00:10:04
    well since 1990s is it has always been
  • 00:10:07
    an index on repeated purchases but with
  • 00:10:10
    talent and loyalty is we have the full
  • 00:10:14
    engagement and tokenization of the of
  • 00:10:17
    data where any engagement that brand
  • 00:10:21
    wants you to do becomes a loyalty index
  • 00:10:25
    where as you earn more rewards by
  • 00:10:28
    completing contributes earned
  • 00:10:29
    experiences you lock these rewards to I
  • 00:10:33
    upgrade your membership or spend your
  • 00:10:36
    rewards and essentially be rewarded for
  • 00:10:39
    your engagement and becoming a core
  • 00:10:41
    create core like co-creator influencer
  • 00:10:45
    and Advocate and with this tooling what
  • 00:10:47
    we see is the future of data and
  • 00:10:49
    marketing because in the well in what we
  • 00:10:52
    call with Brands 3.0 customers will not
  • 00:10:55
    be only consumers to the product if they
  • 00:10:57
    will be co-creators influencers and
  • 00:11:00
    stakeholders and we encounter provides
  • 00:11:02
    that full infrastructure to create those
  • 00:11:05
    loyalty indexes and identities and
  • 00:11:07
    memberships to do that yeah it's really
  • 00:11:09
    interesting to see the brands uh have
  • 00:11:13
    traditionally treat the Loyalty program
  • 00:11:15
    for Passive consumers so if you're not
  • 00:11:18
    spending money your debt to me basically
  • 00:11:19
    right where is the real brand building
  • 00:11:22
    for some of the direct consumer d2c
  • 00:11:24
    brand is that kind of excitement but
  • 00:11:26
    it's uncompensated and yeah you can put
  • 00:11:28
    an affiliate code but unless you're like
  • 00:11:30
    one of the top influencers those
  • 00:11:31
    affiliate code doesn't add up to much
  • 00:11:33
    um so essentially it's Goodwill it's
  • 00:11:35
    it's it's and this Goodwill really is
  • 00:11:38
    somewhere Chuck is super important for
  • 00:11:41
    an establishing new product category a
  • 00:11:42
    new product within a larger organization
  • 00:11:44
    but it's completely either uncompensated
  • 00:11:46
    but more importantly unrecognized so
  • 00:11:49
    what do you see that this whole idea of
  • 00:11:51
    dynamic nft like you know nft is pretty
  • 00:11:53
    static I only bought a but I don't have
  • 00:11:55
    it and you know it's almost like I I
  • 00:11:57
    traded away my 1K status from United
  • 00:12:01
    which you can't really do right so
  • 00:12:02
    there's some non-transferability so
  • 00:12:04
    bound as in United uh mileage what is
  • 00:12:07
    your sense of the tradability of nft and
  • 00:12:10
    this idea of earned long-term loyalty so
  • 00:12:12
    it's not as mercenary how is it Dynamic
  • 00:12:14
    and how is it not just like another
  • 00:12:16
    collectible yeah that's a good question
  • 00:12:18
    and we think like you're essentially
  • 00:12:21
    tapping into like what we think is the
  • 00:12:23
    next hypothesis of where nfts are going
  • 00:12:25
    where nfts are main merely like the
  • 00:12:27
    infrastructure so what we do with
  • 00:12:30
    Dynamic nfts is essentially create a
  • 00:12:32
    system where users can upgrade their
  • 00:12:35
    nfts or as they earn in the ecosystem
  • 00:12:38
    they are they upgrade the tier of their
  • 00:12:41
    nfts and by the nature of their new
  • 00:12:44
    loyalty status and index their nft
  • 00:12:47
    changes visually too we have seen like
  • 00:12:50
    generative on chain projects or dynamic
  • 00:12:52
    nft projects that have
  • 00:12:55
    um experimented with this idea but we
  • 00:12:57
    haven't seen a real world use case that
  • 00:13:00
    Dynamic nfts are perfect for and it is
  • 00:13:02
    actually perfect for loyalty index and
  • 00:13:04
    membership index so we are essentially
  • 00:13:07
    taking nfts and membership to our next
  • 00:13:09
    level where the moment you're in it's
  • 00:13:13
    not a world where the moment you're in
  • 00:13:14
    you're done but that you need to keep
  • 00:13:17
    engaging and gamify the engagement such
  • 00:13:19
    that you you can upgrade your membership
  • 00:13:22
    and up and open the worlds of different
  • 00:13:25
    partners and creators through this world
  • 00:13:27
    too
  • 00:13:28
    I suddenly check my uh Marriott app as I
  • 00:13:31
    do I still have gold yes
  • 00:13:33
    I haven't traveled as much since the
  • 00:13:36
    pandemic so I think they were extending
  • 00:13:38
    some loyalty for like grace period now I
  • 00:13:40
    probably will be losing them left right
  • 00:13:41
    in the center and that's a dynamic thing
  • 00:13:43
    my membership is you know the number
  • 00:13:45
    stays with me but the levels changes
  • 00:13:48
    depends on whether I'm engaging in in a
  • 00:13:50
    given way
  • 00:13:51
    um you mentioned that the whole uh
  • 00:13:54
    upgrading and downgrading is something
  • 00:13:56
    that's data driven
  • 00:13:58
    um so in in on web3 at least right now
  • 00:14:00
    before we talk about privacy technology
  • 00:14:02
    which is a separate issues altogether
  • 00:14:03
    most of the interaction data about
  • 00:14:05
    people do on chain is public uh how is
  • 00:14:08
    that useful for marketers uh is that
  • 00:14:11
    something that they understand it's like
  • 00:14:13
    while they don't get access to the first
  • 00:14:15
    party data like Amazon and apple apple
  • 00:14:17
    especially not there's this public data
  • 00:14:20
    do they see that as something that's a
  • 00:14:22
    gold mine or they haven't recognized the
  • 00:14:23
    power of users transaction and interest
  • 00:14:25
    and participation being a in indexable
  • 00:14:29
    yeah that is such a great question and
  • 00:14:31
    uh it is in so interesting because it's
  • 00:14:35
    uh the first thing you said they didn't
  • 00:14:37
    realize the gold mine yet so when we
  • 00:14:39
    tell brands that you can not only like
  • 00:14:43
    um essentially track repeated purchases
  • 00:14:45
    of your customers but actually The
  • 00:14:48
    Impressions where they check in with
  • 00:14:50
    their nft where they sign in with their
  • 00:14:51
    nft or who what are the other wallets or
  • 00:14:54
    creators they interact with they just
  • 00:14:57
    think it's not possible and basically we
  • 00:15:01
    see a data Revolution that is about to
  • 00:15:04
    come here too blockchain data has not
  • 00:15:06
    been um semantic or readable for so long
  • 00:15:10
    that we had this mind mind of data that
  • 00:15:13
    was not usable by Brands so what Calder
  • 00:15:17
    is one of the verticals do is also
  • 00:15:19
    become the main data portal that is
  • 00:15:22
    fully integrated to a marketer stack but
  • 00:15:24
    is also abstracting enough so that
  • 00:15:27
    blockchain data uh just looks like a
  • 00:15:29
    marketing data so we turn nft
  • 00:15:33
    signings into actually Impressions and
  • 00:15:35
    we think signing on like with your nft
  • 00:15:38
    and proving that your signing will be
  • 00:15:41
    the new era of Impressions that we used
  • 00:15:44
    to have in web 2 Instagram and ads and
  • 00:15:47
    there's many more data metric Primitives
  • 00:15:49
    that uh blockchain technology will bring
  • 00:15:52
    us that we will see the future of uh as
  • 00:15:55
    interactive partnership Partnerships and
  • 00:15:58
    how it will harness the new layer of
  • 00:16:00
    data and engagement that we think will
  • 00:16:03
    build the Next Generation data and
  • 00:16:05
    marketing companies
  • 00:16:07
    yeah and I think you know when we look
  • 00:16:08
    at data the the Big Data movement and
  • 00:16:11
    then turn into like kind of data science
  • 00:16:12
    has been looking at somewhat low
  • 00:16:15
    resolution data around a meaningful
  • 00:16:17
    activity and I think what's interesting
  • 00:16:18
    about blockchain is that while there's
  • 00:16:20
    less data each time you interact that's
  • 00:16:22
    a meaningful data point you didn't just
  • 00:16:24
    Mouse over something or scroll by
  • 00:16:26
    something then there needs to be an
  • 00:16:28
    intention and and what's been really
  • 00:16:30
    great about like you know uh Google is
  • 00:16:32
    that they can say that every single time
  • 00:16:33
    you click on a search engine you know
  • 00:16:35
    link or type in a keyword it's a
  • 00:16:37
    meaningful action and that's why the
  • 00:16:39
    real estate so expensive so valuable uh
  • 00:16:42
    do you see this idea that the customers
  • 00:16:45
    engagement will be mostly around uh
  • 00:16:48
    marketing to people who are already with
  • 00:16:51
    the brand let's say Nike has a program
  • 00:16:52
    and using the on-chain data but you see
  • 00:16:55
    Adidas knocking on the door and say I
  • 00:16:56
    can see what you guys are doing with
  • 00:16:58
    Nike yeah the data is for all to see and
  • 00:17:02
    come and do some competitive offer like
  • 00:17:04
    a dry cleaner saying that I will honor
  • 00:17:06
    my competitor this coupon and I will
  • 00:17:08
    approach my competitive customer you
  • 00:17:10
    don't do you see that opportunity
  • 00:17:11
    because we see those kind of what we
  • 00:17:13
    call vampire attacks and D5 where
  • 00:17:15
    existing values and wallet holder
  • 00:17:17
    becomes an attack Vector uh in a good
  • 00:17:20
    way I would say uh for for growth of
  • 00:17:22
    other competitive Network do you see
  • 00:17:24
    that Dynamic yeah that's a great
  • 00:17:26
    question we think that like there will
  • 00:17:29
    be a lot of like collaboration and
  • 00:17:30
    acquisition strategies that will be
  • 00:17:32
    bootstrapped through this data and
  • 00:17:34
    engagement and then there will be both
  • 00:17:37
    sides of the coin the most important
  • 00:17:39
    part will be that like let's say Nike
  • 00:17:42
    and like Gucci are about to partner what
  • 00:17:46
    they will be able to see is that who are
  • 00:17:48
    my top customers and that have both Nike
  • 00:17:51
    and Gucci and what like what is that
  • 00:17:54
    intersection that will be that should be
  • 00:17:56
    guest listed to the new job and this was
  • 00:17:59
    never possible before because right now
  • 00:18:01
    in web 2 loyalty there is no way to like
  • 00:18:05
    um essentially communicate to segments
  • 00:18:06
    to databases and create cross utility
  • 00:18:09
    Rewards or costs like uh intersection
  • 00:18:13
    and every day there is like a streetwear
  • 00:18:15
    drop on like stockx or retailers and
  • 00:18:19
    then Bots take over the products rather
  • 00:18:22
    than top fans but if there is like a
  • 00:18:25
    supreme drop I think the person who is
  • 00:18:27
    doing the most YouTube videos about
  • 00:18:28
    Supreme that may not have a supreme
  • 00:18:31
    product in itself maybe he is just the
  • 00:18:34
    most engaged but not like the top
  • 00:18:36
    purchaser should be a guest listed so
  • 00:18:39
    these type of data points will be all
  • 00:18:41
    available and will be the next like
  • 00:18:43
    engagement and interoperable
  • 00:18:46
    collaboration rails and what we see for
  • 00:18:48
    like uh competition too I we hypothesize
  • 00:18:53
    that in the 10 to like 10
  • 00:18:56
    year realm Actually All Brands will be
  • 00:18:59
    collaborating and because right now
  • 00:19:01
    there's a non-consumption problem every
  • 00:19:04
    brand chose to Silo their data and
  • 00:19:06
    customer and by that they uh essentially
  • 00:19:10
    are bearing the costs of acquiring new
  • 00:19:12
    customers and we do see a future where
  • 00:19:15
    if we build the new unit swap of Loyalty
  • 00:19:17
    Rewards and uh engagement rails then
  • 00:19:21
    there will be a world night Kennedy that
  • 00:19:24
    will be collaborating too it's and but
  • 00:19:27
    we need to build towards that step by
  • 00:19:29
    step so for sure and then I think this
  • 00:19:32
    idea that uh uh you mentioned the word
  • 00:19:34
    segmentation
  • 00:19:36
    all the projects who are doing airdrops
  • 00:19:39
    and figuring out who to include and
  • 00:19:41
    exclude are essentially doing
  • 00:19:42
    segmentation correct they don't say it
  • 00:19:45
    they just didn't get some blog post
  • 00:19:47
    about how clever they are but Market
  • 00:19:48
    they do that all day long include that
  • 00:19:50
    excluded included except this one and
  • 00:19:53
    they're doing segmentation with tools
  • 00:19:55
    that are immature uh and I sometimes
  • 00:19:58
    feel like you guys should just get these
  • 00:19:59
    marketing Cloud things and do your own
  • 00:20:01
    segmentation but the results here is
  • 00:20:04
    challenging right in the segmentation
  • 00:20:05
    you can do a certain things send some
  • 00:20:06
    email but here you have to create a
  • 00:20:08
    natural program you have to modify your
  • 00:20:11
    token gating or your guest listing
  • 00:20:12
    system or you have to do a miracle-based
  • 00:20:15
    airdrop uh so the delivery mechanism
  • 00:20:18
    which was worth three well but the
  • 00:20:19
    actual computation and thinking that now
  • 00:20:21
    analysis is very uniquely web too so
  • 00:20:24
    there's just a tremendous opportunity to
  • 00:20:27
    bring those two worlds together uh what
  • 00:20:29
    do you see is the challenge of
  • 00:20:31
    aggregating the data that already exists
  • 00:20:33
    about customer in web 2 like within
  • 00:20:35
    their existing databases email lists as
  • 00:20:37
    well as this interaction is the
  • 00:20:39
    association uh much like the brick and
  • 00:20:42
    mortar online phase where they want to
  • 00:20:43
    associate those users to their is that
  • 00:20:45
    important or do you think that the word
  • 00:20:47
    three engagement as kind of independent
  • 00:20:48
    of who goes to your store or who bought
  • 00:20:51
    something on your online site on Black
  • 00:20:52
    Friday yeah that's a great question and
  • 00:20:54
    we
  • 00:20:55
    there will be both
  • 00:20:57
    Sonos one that will build their new
  • 00:20:59
    world identities in these membership
  • 00:21:01
    portals which is totally viable because
  • 00:21:03
    if they're engaging and my like name is
  • 00:21:06
    like 0x dgd like uh dot is it is still a
  • 00:21:12
    fact that I'm a loyal customer and I'm
  • 00:21:14
    like keep purchasing or engaging or like
  • 00:21:16
    contributing to this brand and it just
  • 00:21:18
    doesn't matter who I am what is my
  • 00:21:20
    gender and what is my birthday and this
  • 00:21:22
    also shows how archaic our data
  • 00:21:25
    collection today is when we go to
  • 00:21:27
    Shopify the first thing they ask me is
  • 00:21:28
    my name birth date and gender but more
  • 00:21:31
    importantly what they should know is
  • 00:21:33
    probably which music I like which like a
  • 00:21:36
    dress I want to buy from this shop or uh
  • 00:21:39
    what are the other creators and brands
  • 00:21:42
    that I know is synergistic with the
  • 00:21:44
    brand I'm purchasing but I'm not gonna
  • 00:21:46
    that I'm not telling the brand this data
  • 00:21:49
    at this point or which experience they
  • 00:21:51
    should be presenting for me so what we
  • 00:21:54
    are seeing now is essentially if we can
  • 00:21:57
    when we use contribute to earn
  • 00:22:00
    experience as well we are creating new
  • 00:22:02
    layer loyalty and identity indexes so if
  • 00:22:06
    I'm I keep pushing content for night
  • 00:22:08
    Keys like Air Forces or even like
  • 00:22:10
    painting and Air Forces in Brooklyn and
  • 00:22:13
    then posting the pictures of it and I'm
  • 00:22:15
    racking UP Rewards and they're like
  • 00:22:17
    let's say working with Supreme and I'm
  • 00:22:19
    also a top customer and supreme
  • 00:22:21
    regardless who I am in the real world I
  • 00:22:24
    should be getting the Early Access
  • 00:22:25
    because right now there's so much data
  • 00:22:27
    about my engagement and loyalty index so
  • 00:22:30
    what weird in short like bringing
  • 00:22:31
    together here is a new layer like
  • 00:22:33
    loyalty identity that is not necessarily
  • 00:22:37
    dependent on who you are in like the
  • 00:22:39
    real world right and and it's really
  • 00:22:41
    interesting right because if you buy
  • 00:22:43
    these uh uh when you're engaging you're
  • 00:22:45
    earning these virtual virtual currency
  • 00:22:48
    for you know dollars on Nike uh but you
  • 00:22:51
    know eventually you may want to redeem
  • 00:22:52
    it for an actual Air Force One Another
  • 00:22:54
    limited edition one what is the
  • 00:22:56
    connection do you see the Commerce of
  • 00:22:58
    the actual redemption or the getting a
  • 00:23:00
    discount because of a certain level to
  • 00:23:02
    be settled through crypto and then kind
  • 00:23:04
    of like unisex how your buy the socks
  • 00:23:07
    token then you can if you want to spend
  • 00:23:10
    seven dollars and redeem the actual
  • 00:23:11
    stock that's a real Ultimate Flex right
  • 00:23:13
    for a lot of people do you see this idea
  • 00:23:15
    that the nft sale in a platform like
  • 00:23:18
    openc or other competitive and it is the
  • 00:23:21
    point of sale for that transaction and
  • 00:23:23
    the whole real world supply chain of
  • 00:23:25
    shipping and handling is just a
  • 00:23:26
    fulfillment against that uh do you see
  • 00:23:28
    that Commerce moving on chain that way
  • 00:23:30
    with a substantive transaction buying
  • 00:23:32
    the product is on chain yeah that's a
  • 00:23:34
    great question and we think like at
  • 00:23:37
    Calder we have a philosophy that like
  • 00:23:39
    nothing that should be it shouldn't be
  • 00:23:41
    on chain should be forced to be on chain
  • 00:23:43
    because it's so costly and needless and
  • 00:23:45
    we see a lot of like people in the
  • 00:23:47
    landscape trying to put like everything
  • 00:23:49
    on chain but using the right like uh
  • 00:23:52
    Integrations and on-ramps and off ramps
  • 00:23:54
    are critical so what this means in this
  • 00:23:56
    case is like if we are the uh if we are
  • 00:23:59
    out living like childish full light
  • 00:24:01
    white labeled infrastructure is living
  • 00:24:03
    on the members.brand.com and brand is
  • 00:24:06
    using Shopify for their like shop
  • 00:24:08
    experience they're essentially using our
  • 00:24:11
    nft gated membership to launch an
  • 00:24:13
    exclusive drop and the full like
  • 00:24:15
    payments is under like childhood Rewards
  • 00:24:18
    or like a crypt or crypto or Fiat but
  • 00:24:22
    the full shipping and settlement is just
  • 00:24:24
    like any Commerce and that we think our
  • 00:24:27
    core value proposition is creating new
  • 00:24:29
    engagement data and marketing rails but
  • 00:24:32
    it's but and bring the full Commerce
  • 00:24:34
    integration and power Commerce but to
  • 00:24:37
    not be new Shopify so that we do see
  • 00:24:40
    like we have built a lot of the
  • 00:24:42
    Integrations to make it work but and it
  • 00:24:44
    should be fully integrated but it it
  • 00:24:46
    does not need to be on chain right
  • 00:24:48
    exactly so you can look at it if you got
  • 00:24:50
    a free drop it's like your nft
  • 00:24:52
    membership give you a one-time use 100
  • 00:24:54
    off coupon code so it's still at the end
  • 00:24:58
    of the day fulfilled in a more
  • 00:24:59
    traditional way but there's a bridge on
  • 00:25:01
    that and then you can certainly track
  • 00:25:02
    that that actually got redeemed exactly
  • 00:25:04
    yeah
  • 00:25:05
    um you know you know we at cost like we
  • 00:25:07
    will work on a lot of the underlying
  • 00:25:09
    infrastructure uh you mentioned that you
  • 00:25:12
    have you know worked in in the openc
  • 00:25:14
    with the marketplace thing and before
  • 00:25:15
    that worked on essentially the layer one
  • 00:25:18
    layer two type of crypto infrastructure
  • 00:25:20
    what do you think is a missing piece of
  • 00:25:22
    technology in the crypto stack that
  • 00:25:24
    still requires polishing you know I I
  • 00:25:27
    have a thought that like you know we're
  • 00:25:28
    not quite in the iPhone era of crypto
  • 00:25:31
    yet we're kind of in the Blackberry era
  • 00:25:33
    like most of things there you got you
  • 00:25:35
    know you got some sort of touch screen
  • 00:25:36
    you got some sort of keyboard but it's
  • 00:25:38
    not as smooth and it's not really doing
  • 00:25:40
    that um so what do you think is going to
  • 00:25:43
    bring us from the Blackberry iPhone
  • 00:25:44
    error at at the platform layer like one
  • 00:25:47
    level level below the app and these kind
  • 00:25:49
    of toolkit for marketer that you wish uh
  • 00:25:51
    in your experience having work on those
  • 00:25:53
    tools and work with people who are
  • 00:25:54
    working on those two that you wish would
  • 00:25:56
    happen that would make your job building
  • 00:25:58
    this marketing stack much easier yeah
  • 00:26:00
    definitely and I think uh this is not on
  • 00:26:03
    the layer one level but like we should
  • 00:26:05
    definitely go into that but the first
  • 00:26:07
    and the most core like pain we see day
  • 00:26:09
    to day as a white labeled marketing and
  • 00:26:12
    loyalty solution is
  • 00:26:15
    um not being able to go fully mobile
  • 00:26:16
    like right now like what we have seen is
  • 00:26:19
    with of course like preventions from
  • 00:26:21
    like apple and the new experiences we
  • 00:26:24
    have found our ways around uh many times
  • 00:26:28
    to provide seamless experiences for our
  • 00:26:30
    customers because what characters how
  • 00:26:32
    calendar is different from a lot of web3
  • 00:26:34
    like products is our product is not for
  • 00:26:38
    web3 if our Market is the 250 billion
  • 00:26:42
    dollars spend in loyalty and CRM and we
  • 00:26:45
    want to take it all but if we want to
  • 00:26:47
    take it all we need to also take the web
  • 00:26:49
    2 pie of this and what this means is we
  • 00:26:52
    need to be the most seamless product
  • 00:26:54
    both web 2 and web3 and it is so hard
  • 00:26:57
    just like you said it's like Blackberry
  • 00:26:59
    era of web3 and competing with the Apple
  • 00:27:02
    era of web2 so when
  • 00:27:06
    yeah when we are putting the Apple
  • 00:27:11
    wallets like uh or like our like
  • 00:27:13
    memberships in uh responsive web apps
  • 00:27:16
    instead of mobile apps what happens is
  • 00:27:19
    we do have uh like a friction in our
  • 00:27:23
    technology that is not dependent on
  • 00:27:25
    Calder that we need to like hack around
  • 00:27:28
    with
  • 00:27:29
    um and that it that is something we know
  • 00:27:32
    like uh with a like good design or like
  • 00:27:36
    uh API like infrastructure we can like
  • 00:27:38
    figure out but that Going Mobile will
  • 00:27:42
    help cross the chasm in the next years
  • 00:27:44
    uh especially for a tool like colored uh
  • 00:27:48
    um and that will be very critical yeah
  • 00:27:51
    and it's it's really interesting to see
  • 00:27:52
    how even the best mobile wallet web3
  • 00:27:55
    wallet that has wallet connect are
  • 00:27:57
    speaking the language of a crypto user
  • 00:28:00
    to a gonna be you know buying and
  • 00:28:02
    selling tokens and swapping those verbs
  • 00:28:05
    that are in there are not everyday verbs
  • 00:28:08
    like people are not day Traders like and
  • 00:28:11
    and you know making crafts and charts is
  • 00:28:13
    actually getting the way and this hasn't
  • 00:28:15
    been a a an experience that can be
  • 00:28:17
    either used as a companion app or a
  • 00:28:19
    white label or a kind of a platform
  • 00:28:21
    there's no WeChat of a global wallet I
  • 00:28:24
    mean people thought the telegram will
  • 00:28:25
    build one and they may still end up
  • 00:28:27
    doing so uh but until there's some more
  • 00:28:29
    Innovation around that you know at cost
  • 00:28:31
    like we have a react native team
  • 00:28:32
    focusing on figuring out what is the
  • 00:28:35
    right layer subtraction like when are we
  • 00:28:37
    adapting into the mobile ecosystem in
  • 00:28:39
    Google and apple in-app purchase and
  • 00:28:41
    otherwise and when they connecting to
  • 00:28:43
    the uh crypto ecosystem whether that's
  • 00:28:45
    multi-signature account abstraction all
  • 00:28:47
    these kind of concept right gasless
  • 00:28:48
    transaction would be very nice for
  • 00:28:50
    things that you want to do for the first
  • 00:28:52
    time without necessarily having eth or
  • 00:28:53
    worse yet having Matic it's not easy to
  • 00:28:55
    get a layer 2 gas token in the wallet I
  • 00:28:58
    have trouble doing it
  • 00:29:00
    um so um so some of the things we're
  • 00:29:02
    working on but I absolutely agree that
  • 00:29:03
    those are the things that's going to be
  • 00:29:04
    Community effort and I I love what
  • 00:29:06
    Vitalis think talking about around you
  • 00:29:07
    know thinking about social recovery
  • 00:29:09
    thinking about account abstraction as a
  • 00:29:11
    way to make it easier for people to uh
  • 00:29:14
    you know without knowing it dealing with
  • 00:29:16
    a programmable wallet things like that
  • 00:29:18
    that actually speaking all the most
  • 00:29:19
    advanced language of web 3 but it's SEC
  • 00:29:21
    they use as to what you would expect a
  • 00:29:23
    sponsored transaction gasless
  • 00:29:24
    transaction exactly and gases
  • 00:29:27
    transaction is one that is top of mind
  • 00:29:29
    for us too because uh it's very
  • 00:29:31
    unintuitive for a web 2 customer to come
  • 00:29:35
    to a membership and loyalty program and
  • 00:29:38
    pay to submit their proof rights yes
  • 00:29:42
    yeah so they're like how why am I paying
  • 00:29:45
    to my brand in their perspective even
  • 00:29:47
    though it's not to the brand
  • 00:29:50
    um to submit uh a proof that I have like
  • 00:29:54
    attended this event or posted this
  • 00:29:56
    content so there's also like new like
  • 00:29:59
    kind of a technical like Paradigm shifts
  • 00:30:02
    that happen in web 3 that is not native
  • 00:30:04
    in web two that will take a lot of
  • 00:30:07
    terminology and ex like kind of crossing
  • 00:30:11
    the chasm as well and to what you said
  • 00:30:13
    like web3 has a branding problem like
  • 00:30:15
    all the tools all the jargon is designed
  • 00:30:18
    for web3 Natives and that
  • 00:30:22
    um it's not designed for like web2 like
  • 00:30:25
    Integrations and infrastructure to be
  • 00:30:27
    adopted and that's why it feels
  • 00:30:29
    intimidating to jump in yeah I think
  • 00:30:32
    words like wallet gas account Network
  • 00:30:35
    Layer Two none of them are kind of uh
  • 00:30:39
    none of them are leading to conversion
  • 00:30:42
    and engagement they're all kind of
  • 00:30:43
    friction points around that so there's a
  • 00:30:46
    lot to do uh both in terms of the actual
  • 00:30:48
    substance of it but also how we describe
  • 00:30:50
    it and obviously we went abstract it all
  • 00:30:52
    away but one of the things we've learned
  • 00:30:53
    is that you know centralized exchange is
  • 00:30:55
    abstracted all the way but they also
  • 00:30:57
    take it all away because the attraction
  • 00:30:59
    is not actually real your deposit is an
  • 00:31:01
    instigment of your imagination right
  • 00:31:03
    um so so it's important for us to
  • 00:31:06
    actually do the decentralization and do
  • 00:31:08
    that type of like you know user
  • 00:31:10
    ownership brand ownership yet providing
  • 00:31:12
    that thing is a really tricky thing to
  • 00:31:14
    do it's very easy to cheat both ways
  • 00:31:15
    right like totally centralized just say
  • 00:31:18
    crypto and totally crypto and totally
  • 00:31:20
    unusable so we have to find those
  • 00:31:21
    balances yeah you know you know
  • 00:31:23
    obviously you're early on in the project
  • 00:31:25
    uh in your in your journey in in kind of
  • 00:31:28
    scaling up the organization and just
  • 00:31:29
    taking your brand learning what do you
  • 00:31:31
    what when what do you think is the most
  • 00:31:33
    kind of like likely moment where your
  • 00:31:36
    tool set get that first like a consumer
  • 00:31:39
    adoption moment a brand success can you
  • 00:31:41
    tell me what that would look like like
  • 00:31:43
    basically what should I look out for on
  • 00:31:44
    Twitter or whatever it's like oh that
  • 00:31:46
    finally happened yeah she told me and
  • 00:31:48
    prophesied that this will happen one day
  • 00:31:50
    what does that event look like yes I
  • 00:31:52
    think uh it ideally we expect this event
  • 00:31:55
    to be near in like especially in the new
  • 00:31:57
    year
  • 00:31:58
    um so we have done a lot of Pilots with
  • 00:32:00
    Brands and Publications on how we can
  • 00:32:04
    engage their Community but has been
  • 00:32:05
    private or like whitelisted but what is
  • 00:32:08
    up and coming now is one of our biggest
  • 00:32:11
    uh brand Partnerships that will be
  • 00:32:15
    um that will be just like build and
  • 00:32:17
    executed like any marketing software
  • 00:32:19
    where we will be fully integrated and
  • 00:32:22
    taking over a streetwear Brands uh
  • 00:32:26
    loyalty program and May and fully
  • 00:32:29
    deployed on Calder and that three rails
  • 00:32:32
    what this mean is that we will ideally
  • 00:32:35
    have thousands of cut like loyal
  • 00:32:37
    customers to this brand engaging
  • 00:32:40
    creating content attending events making
  • 00:32:43
    repeated purchases and raving about
  • 00:32:45
    their brand all across maintenance
  • 00:32:47
    social network channels and coming back
  • 00:32:50
    to Brand's own website to engage with
  • 00:32:53
    the community whether their own chat
  • 00:32:55
    experience and more so you can say we
  • 00:32:58
    will made we will we made it in the next
  • 00:33:01
    month when we we execute this and bring
  • 00:33:05
    more Brands to create that
  • 00:33:07
    interoperability too right now we serve
  • 00:33:10
    our tools on like dateless onboarding
  • 00:33:12
    bases where Brands self-serve but we
  • 00:33:14
    work closely with them right so in the
  • 00:33:17
    next six months as we are choosing
  • 00:33:20
    uh like work work closely and choose our
  • 00:33:22
    next uh 10 brand Partners our goal is to
  • 00:33:25
    then open source and publicize our tools
  • 00:33:28
    in the next six months so that anyone
  • 00:33:30
    from a Creator to an nft Community to
  • 00:33:33
    brand can use it that's really I think
  • 00:33:36
    amazing because at the end of the day uh
  • 00:33:38
    the brands that we will respect in 2024
  • 00:33:41
    is likely one person somewhere doing
  • 00:33:43
    something you know we think of Mr Beast
  • 00:33:46
    as a brand today but three years ago he
  • 00:33:48
    is just a dude right uh and and and it
  • 00:33:52
    happens all the time this whole
  • 00:33:53
    iteration is way fast way fast and so I
  • 00:33:56
    think any time and then think uh web3
  • 00:33:58
    tools can be permissive uh not
  • 00:34:01
    permissionless as in people can really
  • 00:34:02
    start using the tools for whatever they
  • 00:34:04
    think of uh which the creators sometimes
  • 00:34:07
    don't even imagine that would be used
  • 00:34:09
    that way I'm sure uh the Open Sea people
  • 00:34:12
    didn't really completely see all the
  • 00:34:13
    different ways nfts are being listed so
  • 00:34:17
    I I'm sure you will see a lot of
  • 00:34:19
    creative uses of this loyalty solution
  • 00:34:22
    to things that you don't think of as
  • 00:34:23
    Brands maybe yes individual is obvious
  • 00:34:25
    maybe like you know ideas can become
  • 00:34:28
    Brands who knows
  • 00:34:30
    I I love what you said there because I
  • 00:34:32
    think that's like the infrastructure and
  • 00:34:34
    Foundation we want to create what web2
  • 00:34:37
    marketing tools done wrong is build
  • 00:34:39
    Walgreens for their tools as well like
  • 00:34:41
    right now getting even onboarded to
  • 00:34:43
    Salesforce the hustle and nobody likes
  • 00:34:45
    it what we want Calder to be is the main
  • 00:34:47
    like creative infrastructure engagement
  • 00:34:50
    infrastructure for everything where your
  • 00:34:52
    morning coffee can build their community
  • 00:34:54
    portal too but also your favorite
  • 00:34:56
    musician or you yourself or your like
  • 00:35:00
    podcast can build the community around
  • 00:35:02
    them and engage their customers directly
  • 00:35:04
    too because the core problem here is not
  • 00:35:07
    having a bi-directional engagement
  • 00:35:09
    between community and brand or like the
  • 00:35:12
    founder itself and this is universal
  • 00:35:14
    across many Brands so
  • 00:35:18
    um and like building towards a headless
  • 00:35:19
    Brands and building the infrastructure
  • 00:35:21
    for that is like the full like goal of
  • 00:35:24
    Calder and that people should get
  • 00:35:26
    creative with it yes and I think the
  • 00:35:28
    composability of web 3 and crypto does
  • 00:35:31
    mean that you know different tools will
  • 00:35:34
    be used for different people you know
  • 00:35:35
    within a boundary within one project or
  • 00:35:38
    one protocol and and then the mix and
  • 00:35:40
    matching event you know I I heard about
  • 00:35:42
    people thinking about uh using nft as a
  • 00:35:45
    way to uh deal with a paid membership so
  • 00:35:49
    that could be interesting not just not
  • 00:35:50
    just these kind of like earned status
  • 00:35:52
    but how different are they really right
  • 00:35:54
    like wouldn't you be able to buy a
  • 00:35:56
    membership of something you know
  • 00:35:58
    certainly some Airlines sell the
  • 00:36:00
    membership maybe not directly but by way
  • 00:36:02
    of credit card companies if you get this
  • 00:36:04
    credit card then you get this membership
  • 00:36:05
    so this is really interesting like do
  • 00:36:07
    you earn it or do you buy it and is that
  • 00:36:10
    the same so so those are two different
  • 00:36:12
    types of nft or different commercial
  • 00:36:14
    transactions and and on chain that's way
  • 00:36:16
    easy to compose but when you're talking
  • 00:36:18
    about the back end system of these
  • 00:36:20
    loyalty program and I wasn't involved in
  • 00:36:23
    a in a strategy project to talk about
  • 00:36:25
    airline miles and Status those systems
  • 00:36:28
    are really archaic and they don't really
  • 00:36:30
    integrate
  • 00:36:31
    so limits what they can do yeah it is so
  • 00:36:35
    true like what we don't see like
  • 00:36:38
    um in the front end or like in the
  • 00:36:39
    consumer experiences how much Financial
  • 00:36:41
    modeling or segmentation these loyalty
  • 00:36:43
    programs take and in spite of that much
  • 00:36:46
    work how they don't work because uh
  • 00:36:49
    because right now loyalty is designed
  • 00:36:51
    for customers to not redeem their points
  • 00:36:53
    right because it's like a mechanism
  • 00:36:56
    design that went all wrong so what we
  • 00:36:59
    are doing essentially here is
  • 00:37:01
    redesigning what it means to be loyal
  • 00:37:03
    and earn and upgrade from first
  • 00:37:06
    principles and then redesign and
  • 00:37:09
    redefine what loyalty programs mean and
  • 00:37:12
    right now when we think about loyalty
  • 00:37:14
    programs it's kind of a distaste left in
  • 00:37:16
    us like so 10 off or my gold points that
  • 00:37:20
    I will never be able to take anywhere
  • 00:37:21
    else or my status that doesn't take
  • 00:37:23
    anywhere else but if we can turn these
  • 00:37:26
    siled rewards and Status into a unified
  • 00:37:28
    engagement and index and what we have
  • 00:37:31
    seen with our Pilots is when done right
  • 00:37:33
    it creates more than 70 percent of
  • 00:37:36
    customer engagement to a point where
  • 00:37:38
    when loyalty Works engagement works so
  • 00:37:40
    we're trying to build that Association
  • 00:37:43
    absolutely and I think this is one thing
  • 00:37:46
    that uh the brand people has went from
  • 00:37:48
    completely uh focusing on getting the
  • 00:37:51
    brand out there and then got really into
  • 00:37:53
    the whole uh performance base uh with
  • 00:37:56
    the early you know Google and then
  • 00:37:58
    Facebook kind of repeating a cycle and
  • 00:38:00
    now they felt kind of betrayed by the
  • 00:38:01
    performance model because it actually
  • 00:38:03
    doesn't perform very well if you look at
  • 00:38:04
    the ROI and they're so looking at like
  • 00:38:06
    how do I take my data expertise and
  • 00:38:08
    rethinking this kind of community so
  • 00:38:10
    when you say community is really great
  • 00:38:11
    because the it's just not customers and
  • 00:38:14
    data points and leads right it's it's
  • 00:38:16
    building that and I think in early web3
  • 00:38:18
    Community crypto Community you know for
  • 00:38:21
    the time where everybody is pretty happy
  • 00:38:23
    with each other and then and and and
  • 00:38:24
    their wallets uh it really feels very
  • 00:38:27
    rich and and and and close and if if
  • 00:38:31
    Brian can cultivate those Community I
  • 00:38:32
    think it makes it much easier to compete
  • 00:38:34
    in the world where Amazon try to inject
  • 00:38:36
    themselves in between everything is like
  • 00:38:37
    you got to buy an ad to show up it's
  • 00:38:39
    like but they're searching for my
  • 00:38:40
    product names but this is my search
  • 00:38:42
    engine right like that's happening and
  • 00:38:44
    it's really I'm sure it's very
  • 00:38:45
    frustrating and I see why they're
  • 00:38:47
    seeking community and hopefully web3
  • 00:38:49
    provide that additional rail to make
  • 00:38:51
    those Community meaningful yeah
  • 00:38:53
    definitely and what we are seeing um as
  • 00:38:56
    a paradigm shift also for Brands is like
  • 00:38:58
    they are even stop calling their
  • 00:39:00
    customers customers about Community like
  • 00:39:02
    it's the customer management but
  • 00:39:04
    Community Management so these words will
  • 00:39:07
    be ingrained to our language even more
  • 00:39:09
    and right now especially uh we try to
  • 00:39:13
    work with brands that are Community
  • 00:39:14
    First even like a product second to a
  • 00:39:17
    point because what we've seen is if you
  • 00:39:19
    build the right Community products sells
  • 00:39:21
    in itself anyways so once the Playbook
  • 00:39:23
    of this new generation marketing and
  • 00:39:25
    loyalty is written we will like
  • 00:39:27
    basically put the d2c Playbook off the
  • 00:39:29
    shell to the shelves and then start
  • 00:39:31
    using the new Community Driven marketing
  • 00:39:34
    and engagement tools yeah absolutely and
  • 00:39:36
    there was a saying about how there used
  • 00:39:38
    to be a point where Capital allows you
  • 00:39:40
    to create audience and now it's the
  • 00:39:42
    reverse is true audience or in this case
  • 00:39:44
    Community actually drives Capital
  • 00:39:46
    whoever have an audience Capital will
  • 00:39:48
    chase after them you have a community
  • 00:39:49
    engaged Community you can go ahead and
  • 00:39:52
    order million dollars with a product
  • 00:39:54
    tomorrow someone will give you that
  • 00:39:55
    money right and I think it's not
  • 00:39:57
    entirely clear yet that that's happening
  • 00:39:59
    uh but hopefully you know I'm excited
  • 00:40:02
    about uh what you guys are working on
  • 00:40:03
    but also intersecting with other people
  • 00:40:05
    about like financing the first uh
  • 00:40:08
    product using these kind of future
  • 00:40:09
    Revenue as a way to kind of borrow
  • 00:40:12
    against that thing you can maybe have
  • 00:40:13
    people make physical product that way
  • 00:40:15
    and that type of like you know you know
  • 00:40:17
    infantry financing the risk taking
  • 00:40:19
    hasn't necessarily happened uh in a
  • 00:40:22
    fluid way or more importantly in a
  • 00:40:24
    successful way of which the people who
  • 00:40:26
    are building community that matters have
  • 00:40:28
    access to only suits have access to or
  • 00:40:30
    people have vest right they have the
  • 00:40:32
    pentagonia vestalities as not not suits
  • 00:40:35
    vests but I I would love to see web3
  • 00:40:38
    democratize both the building or
  • 00:40:40
    community and building engagement but
  • 00:40:42
    also the financing of these to become
  • 00:40:44
    actual uh big brands that has Global
  • 00:40:47
    supply chain that would be beautiful
  • 00:40:48
    yeah that's like a great to like talk
  • 00:40:50
    about because like we also think the
  • 00:40:52
    next generation of Brands will be the
  • 00:40:54
    ones like essentially are the the blue
  • 00:40:56
    chip off brands that will lead what it
  • 00:40:58
    is like to build and gauge and we are
  • 00:41:00
    seeing this already I think streetwear
  • 00:41:03
    is a great example where the cult like
  • 00:41:05
    following of streetwear is the
  • 00:41:08
    proposition to the customers it's not
  • 00:41:10
    the sneakers it it's not like the
  • 00:41:13
    product jobs but even the drop culture
  • 00:41:16
    which is so similar to web3 is
  • 00:41:19
    um essentially the main value
  • 00:41:20
    proposition to associate with who you
  • 00:41:22
    want to be and who you like to be and
  • 00:41:25
    and I don't think we have the tech yet
  • 00:41:27
    to connect these people and by doing
  • 00:41:29
    this we will unlock the new like what we
  • 00:41:32
    call Brands 3.0 Brands who are like uh
  • 00:41:35
    taking their customers as co-creators
  • 00:41:37
    and engagement and the pain has never
  • 00:41:39
    been more real like like you said when
  • 00:41:41
    we look at engagement what we see at
  • 00:41:43
    Calder is the marketing Playbook is so
  • 00:41:46
    saturated and leading to such a low
  • 00:41:48
    engagement that around 50 of consumers
  • 00:41:51
    report they will switch to a brand
  • 00:41:54
    product or any other the retailer then
  • 00:41:57
    faced with other offers or customer
  • 00:42:00
    better customer experience so customers
  • 00:42:03
    are craving this connection emotional
  • 00:42:05
    communal connection but they are not
  • 00:42:08
    getting it yes and and the the
  • 00:42:11
    commoditization that comes with the
  • 00:42:12
    platform setting in the way certainly
  • 00:42:14
    dilutes a little bit but I do believe
  • 00:42:16
    that nobody thinks of themselves as a as
  • 00:42:19
    a Google loyalist uh yeah those like you
  • 00:42:22
    know I I don't trust the search result
  • 00:42:25
    people uh even on social media it's like
  • 00:42:27
    well you know I use tick tock to find
  • 00:42:29
    things I might like do I trust them not
  • 00:42:31
    at all right so I think the new
  • 00:42:33
    generation is definitely clear about the
  • 00:42:34
    utility and the exchange but they trust
  • 00:42:38
    the community they trust this streetwear
  • 00:42:40
    brand they trust the people online with
  • 00:42:42
    them waiting for the next drop in the
  • 00:42:43
    physical store and so on right and and I
  • 00:42:46
    think there's something really really
  • 00:42:47
    deep there that is both you know
  • 00:42:49
    intrinsically human and I think one
  • 00:42:50
    thing about web 3 design or if in crypto
  • 00:42:53
    is that a lot of what determine what
  • 00:42:55
    happens is human nature and
  • 00:42:56
    rediscovering that again right uh to Le
  • 00:42:59
    Mania it's on a human event and we have
  • 00:43:02
    it again but then again the growth of a
  • 00:43:04
    new community online communities also
  • 00:43:07
    human nature and we're seeing that again
  • 00:43:08
    uh so it would be really interesting to
  • 00:43:10
    see when The Primitives exist and the
  • 00:43:13
    iPhone era of web3 competing you know
  • 00:43:15
    just as well maybe better than the
  • 00:43:17
    iPhone era web 2 happened I would be
  • 00:43:20
    lovely to see what new form emerge and
  • 00:43:22
    more importantly what over uh o o form
  • 00:43:25
    re-emerge and surprises again about the
  • 00:43:28
    beauty of the human relationships yeah I
  • 00:43:30
    love that because I think what we're
  • 00:43:32
    doing at Calder is not loyalty marketing
  • 00:43:35
    all these words we are building
  • 00:43:37
    infrastructure for Brands to build
  • 00:43:39
    communities and engage with each other
  • 00:43:41
    and it's not in an archaic marketing way
  • 00:43:43
    because brands are creators people we
  • 00:43:47
    trust or individuals or like people we
  • 00:43:50
    want to engage with and have so much
  • 00:43:51
    emotions around but have never been able
  • 00:43:54
    to build that connection with because it
  • 00:43:56
    was not scalable or right thing to do so
  • 00:43:58
    so if we come to a point where Calder is
  • 00:44:02
    both for Brands and Community is the way
  • 00:44:04
    uh people connect with each other and be
  • 00:44:07
    creative with then we have done our job
  • 00:44:10
    and we're essentially betting on a
  • 00:44:12
    behavior change here the moment we that
  • 00:44:14
    we create that bi-directional engagement
  • 00:44:17
    then we create that new product category
  • 00:44:20
    of what it is to build loyalty and you
  • 00:44:24
    know when we think about web3 as a as a
  • 00:44:27
    field it's like oh what is it all about
  • 00:44:28
    it's just you know numbers going up
  • 00:44:30
    going down uh but you know I think we
  • 00:44:32
    think about this as a you know people
  • 00:44:34
    say coordination in an abstract way but
  • 00:44:36
    human coordination and human
  • 00:44:38
    communication that's that's always going
  • 00:44:40
    to work I mean the internet's about that
  • 00:44:42
    social media is that what it's it
  • 00:44:44
    doesn't work it doesn't work it doesn't
  • 00:44:45
    work until it does and then it defines
  • 00:44:48
    an error and I I you know I'm I'm in a
  • 00:44:51
    way bullish on people finding connection
  • 00:44:54
    with each each other through the web and
  • 00:44:56
    whether we add a 3 to the web or two to
  • 00:44:58
    the web it's just a way to actually make
  • 00:45:01
    it even more convenient and deeper in
  • 00:45:03
    that way so yeah definitely I mean even
  • 00:45:06
    to a point where like how we meet with
  • 00:45:08
    people on Twitter and become Twitter
  • 00:45:10
    friends show how we like surpass Tech to
  • 00:45:14
    still find connections absolutely and
  • 00:45:16
    think about the world we built the right
  • 00:45:18
    tech for right Community engagement and
  • 00:45:20
    Trust then we built the right human
  • 00:45:22
    coordination and I think we are getting
  • 00:45:25
    there and we are definitely in the
  • 00:45:27
    Blackberry era but I think with the this
  • 00:45:29
    like a market it's a great time to build
  • 00:45:32
    and build towards that uh like apple era
  • 00:45:35
    both for infrastructure level and um
  • 00:45:37
    essentially like use cases level
  • 00:45:40
    absolutely well this is really really
  • 00:45:43
    awesome to have a conversation about
  • 00:45:45
    things that I'm sure not getting covered
  • 00:45:47
    a lot in the web 3 space because I think
  • 00:45:49
    a lot of web 3 is very insular looking
  • 00:45:51
    but if you look at the two sets that we
  • 00:45:53
    can offer to people in the Hunger there
  • 00:45:56
    is from the customer to become community
  • 00:45:58
    members and Brands to become more like
  • 00:46:00
    you know in a way connected uh
  • 00:46:03
    disintemate again with the customer
  • 00:46:05
    that's just a huge demand for it and you
  • 00:46:09
    know the demand for web 3 is going to
  • 00:46:11
    come from the demand for the use case
  • 00:46:12
    and a second effect is all the other
  • 00:46:15
    stuff that we talk about right numbers
  • 00:46:17
    and stuff like that
  • 00:46:18
    um so thank you very much for your time
  • 00:46:20
    today uh are there anything else you
  • 00:46:22
    want to kind of tell our audience about
  • 00:46:24
    what's about to happen or uh teasers and
  • 00:46:27
    stuff yeah definitely so in the uh we
  • 00:46:31
    are still finalizing our like brands
  • 00:46:33
    that we are working with if you're a
  • 00:46:35
    brand or a creator that like this like
  • 00:46:37
    excites you would love to chat and
  • 00:46:39
    calder.xyz or calendar.app is a great
  • 00:46:42
    place to reach out uh to us and our
  • 00:46:45
    socials tell their world but at the same
  • 00:46:47
    time uh if if as a consumer Creator
  • 00:46:51
    whoever you are this ideas excite you
  • 00:46:53
    just sign up or join the wait list and
  • 00:46:56
    we have many brand public launches
  • 00:46:58
    coming in the new year that we will
  • 00:47:00
    co-market With Our Brands we are working
  • 00:47:02
    with retailers uh streetwear Brands
  • 00:47:05
    um DJs like influencers so many like nft
  • 00:47:08
    communities like podcasts there will be
  • 00:47:11
    so many like uh loyalty programs
  • 00:47:14
    launched on Calder in the next year that
  • 00:47:17
    you can find something to connect with
  • 00:47:19
    but more importantly be part of this
  • 00:47:21
    like future of Engagement so
  • 00:47:24
    um I tell there's uh xyzing and our
  • 00:47:27
    socials are a great way to follow that
  • 00:47:29
    and participate our nft memberships for
  • 00:47:32
    these Brands will be live very soon in
  • 00:47:35
    the New Year it's so exciting because
  • 00:47:37
    when people see these Brands come in and
  • 00:47:39
    they connect they're not gonna
  • 00:47:40
    immediately think crypto or got for BF
  • 00:47:43
    FTX so they're gonna think oh really
  • 00:47:45
    interesting tag or very interesting uh
  • 00:47:47
    new things to do in our digital lives
  • 00:47:49
    and the intersection on that and that's
  • 00:47:51
    really where it becomes uh the the ramp
  • 00:47:54
    of going into web 3 becoming
  • 00:47:55
    non-existent it's just you know I call
  • 00:47:58
    it the land of the web 3 it's just the
  • 00:47:59
    web extended it's just a greater web
  • 00:48:02
    area covered by web3 with with a new
  • 00:48:05
    technology to connect like a bridge
  • 00:48:07
    behind me it just extends the the the
  • 00:48:09
    landscape of the web to something that
  • 00:48:11
    wasn't addressable before well thank you
  • 00:48:14
    very much for your time today I had a
  • 00:48:16
    great uh uh experience with uh talking
  • 00:48:19
    about these you know topics that I
  • 00:48:21
    believe are going to be the unlocking of
  • 00:48:23
    not only the the excitement around web3
  • 00:48:26
    but more importantly the real spend
  • 00:48:28
    right like real revenues brand spending
  • 00:48:30
    money instead of on Facebook on web3 and
  • 00:48:33
    that is the kind of few I have a big
  • 00:48:35
    belief that uh if we focus on
  • 00:48:37
    consumption and revenue and not
  • 00:48:39
    speculation and kind of like you know
  • 00:48:41
    like Leverage we will actually make for
  • 00:48:44
    much more fulfilling and satisfying and
  • 00:48:47
    more sustainable economy so any use case
  • 00:48:49
    that brings money from one place that's
  • 00:48:51
    being spent to money spent on web3 in
  • 00:48:54
    this land would be health healthy for
  • 00:48:56
    our industry growth and and Thrive yeah
  • 00:49:00
    I totally agree and it was great to chat
  • 00:49:01
    with you Chris too I think it's very
  • 00:49:04
    special to dig deep
  • 00:49:05
    to the next four to ten like five years
  • 00:49:07
    of crypto and really see what's the
  • 00:49:09
    future rather than focusing on like the
  • 00:49:12
    Shilling or like uh the ups and downs I
  • 00:49:14
    think what will always say is the true
  • 00:49:16
    proposition of like blockchain
  • 00:49:19
    technology ownership economy and
  • 00:49:21
    bringing right uh ownership and
  • 00:49:23
    engagement Primitives to the world of
  • 00:49:25
    consumers and Brands and that's what
  • 00:49:27
    we're hyper focused on and it was super
  • 00:49:29
    great to chat on that absolutely uh and
  • 00:49:32
    and always or thanks our community for
  • 00:49:35
    time and attention uh we do this every
  • 00:49:36
    two weeks to talk to Founders who are
  • 00:49:38
    actually building use cases around web 3
  • 00:49:41
    and using the technology that we all
  • 00:49:43
    love in a way that other people outside
  • 00:49:45
    of our field would love uh they may not
  • 00:49:47
    love nft but they're gonna love being
  • 00:49:49
    recognized for who they are what they've
  • 00:49:51
    done and what they will continue to do
  • 00:49:53
    and that type of human connection and
  • 00:49:55
    reward and recognition is what you
  • 00:49:56
    strive for and hopefully that becomes a
  • 00:49:58
    thing that billion people will feel the
  • 00:50:00
    same way they open a wallet to check in
  • 00:50:02
    in the in their status on calendar but
  • 00:50:05
    something thank you so so much and until
  • 00:50:07
    next time take care
  • 00:50:08
    [Music]
  • 00:50:17
    [Music]
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