Henrik Kniberg: How I made Product Ownership in a Nutshell and Generative AI in a Nutshell videos

00:57:23
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xy3LRdXFyfk

Résumé

TLDRHenrik Nyberg, a notable figure in the field of agile practices and generative AI, discusses his career evolution, his work with companies like Spotify and Lego, and his insights into the use of AI in modern product development. Nyberg highlights Spotify's unique company culture that embraced agile methodologies, which was fundamental to its early success. He also shares his experience at Lego, emphasizing the importance of continuous user engagement in design processes. Currently, Nyberg is involved in exploring AI's potential as digital co-workers, focusing on building AI agents. He offers a behind-the-scenes look at his process for creating popular educational videos that explain complex topics through engaging visuals, underscoring the need for concise communication and effective use of visualization tools like ArtRage and ScreenFlow. Throughout the talk, Nyberg stresses the collaborative potential of combining AI with human ingenuity.

A retenir

  • 🎨 Visual explanation is key for understanding complex concepts.
  • 🚀 Spotify's agile culture contributed significantly to its success.
  • 🎶 Henrik's early career plans included music before choosing tech.
  • 🤖 AI as digital co-workers is an emerging trend.
  • 📚 Continuous user feedback is crucial, as seen at Lego.
  • ✏️ Drawing live engages audiences more effectively than slides.
  • ⏱ Effective video storytelling requires careful scripting and timing.
  • 🛠 Tools like ArtRage and ScreenFlow are essential for video production.
  • 🤝 The future lies in AI-human collaboration.
  • 💡 Innovation comes from combining technology with creative thinking.

Chronologie

  • 00:00:00 - 00:05:00

    The speaker introduces the interview with Henrik Nyberg, highlighting his expertise in generative AI and mentioning his experiences with companies like Spotify and LEGO. The session is formatted like a podcast with a focus on learning about Henrik’s background and expertise.

  • 00:05:00 - 00:10:00

    Henrik shares his background, growing up in Tokyo, his early interest in computers and music, and his transition from aspiring musician to programmer. He discusses the balance between arts and tech and his inclination towards programming as a career path.

  • 00:10:00 - 00:15:00

    He discusses his career path from programmer to entrepreneur, his involvement with startups during the dot-com boom, and transition into management roles, learning product development along the way. Henrik highlights his journey with various startups before getting involved with Spotify.

  • 00:15:00 - 00:20:00

    Henrik talks about his early days at Spotify, describing it as a startup with an agile mindset from the beginning. He was involved in scaling the company with an emphasis on speed of innovation. He debunks myths about others using the 'Spotify model' for agile transformation.

  • 00:20:00 - 00:25:00

    He describes the cultural aspects and agility at Spotify that allowed it to outperform larger competitors despite having fewer resources. Henrik outlines the company's focus on maintaining minimal bureaucracy and the management mindset prioritizing speed and agility.

  • 00:25:00 - 00:30:00

    Henrik contrasts this with his experience at LEGO, where he witnessed their openness to change and adoption of agile practices despite being a larger company. He appreciated LEGO’s focus on user involvement in design processes and the lessons he learned from their operational practices.

  • 00:30:00 - 00:35:00

    He shares his contribution to Minecraft, where he worked on features like terrain generation and behaviors of character children. Henrik’s current focus is on the application of AI in tech and product development, with a strong interest in AI agents as digital co-workers.

  • 00:35:00 - 00:40:00

    Henrik explains that AI combined with human intelligence is where true innovation lies. He is working on autonomous AI agents that operate independently to assist in various tasks, illustrating this with a project about a 'digital journalist' working alongside humans.

  • 00:40:00 - 00:45:00

    The presenter, Grant, discusses Henrik’s use of visuals in explaining concepts like the Spotify model. Visuals help convey complex ideas simply. Henrik shares processes behind creating such visuals, like using sketches and visual metaphors for clarity in communication.

  • 00:45:00 - 00:50:00

    Henrik takes the audience through his creative process for making viral videos. He discusses the drafting, scripting, and visual storyboarding involved, including leveraging tools like GPT for content iteration and exploring new ways to convey ideas effectively.

  • 00:50:00 - 00:57:23

    Henrik demonstrates his video creation process, starting with drafting a script, recording voice-over, and using tools like ArtRage and Screenflow to create and edit visuals. He emphasizes the intricate effort that goes into producing succinct, engaging visual content.

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Questions fréquemment posées

  • What is Henrik Nyberg known for?

    Henrik Nyberg is known for his ability to simplify complex concepts, especially in product development and agile practices.

  • Where has Henrik Nyberg worked?

    Henrik Nyberg has worked at companies like Spotify, Lego, and has contributed to Minecraft.

  • What were the early days of Spotify like according to Henrik Nyberg?

    The early days of Spotify were characterized by an agile mindset and a culture optimized for speed, which allowed them to innovate and stay ahead of competitors.

  • What does Henrik Nyberg consider his superpower?

    Henrik Nyberg's superpower is his ability to take complicated things and explain them in a simple way.

  • What is Henrik Nyberg currently focused on?

    Henrik Nyberg’s focus is on the practical application of generative AI in product development and building AI agents as digital co-workers.

  • What tools does Henrik Nyberg use for creating his videos?

    Henrik Nyberg uses tools like ArtRage for drawing and ScreenFlow for recording and editing his videos.

  • What is Henrik Nyberg's view on AI and its future?

    Henrik believes that AI combined with human collaboration is the key to future innovation.

  • Did Henrik Nyberg attend Japanese schools?

    No, Henrik did not attend Japanese schools; he attended an American school in Japan.

  • Why did Henrik Nyberg choose programming over a music career?

    Henrik Nyberg decided to pursue a career in programming while keeping music as a hobby to avoid the pressure of income dependency on it.

  • What did Henrik Nyberg learn from his time at Lego?

    At Lego, Henrik Nyberg observed a strong emphasis on involving users (children) continuously in the design process, which he found very instructive.

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Défilement automatique:
  • 00:00:01
    and I'm just going to
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    Spotlight going to Spotlight
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    us there we go and I'm going to add
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    myself as
  • 00:00:12
    well okay folks thank you so much for
  • 00:00:15
    joining um it's going to be an exciting
  • 00:00:18
    uh 50 minutes that we've got left
  • 00:00:20
    together uh super super excited about
  • 00:00:23
    this session don't ask me how we've got
  • 00:00:25
    this young man on the visual Jam but uh
  • 00:00:28
    we're very grateful for him uh accepting
  • 00:00:31
    the invite and um so we do we have
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    Henrik nyberg who is a chief scientist
  • 00:00:38
    and co-founder of hs.com
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    and fig. a and I've said that totally
  • 00:00:45
    wrong
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    so fleig there you go it means
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    productive awesome uh unlike me and a
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    consultant at crisp um so if you haven't
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    heard of crisp um we'll be posting some
  • 00:01:00
    links out uh in a while and uh you can
  • 00:01:03
    you can check out the amazing work that
  • 00:01:04
    they do there as well and henrik's focus
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    is on uh practic the practical
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    application of generative AI in product
  • 00:01:12
    development and other areas um I'm not
  • 00:01:15
    going to read his whole bio but he's his
  • 00:01:17
    background includes working at the likes
  • 00:01:19
    of Spotify Lego um he's even a
  • 00:01:24
    contributed to Minecraft as well which
  • 00:01:26
    my son was super super interested in so
  • 00:01:29
    I'm going to be quizzing him about that
  • 00:01:31
    um so welcome Henrik nber to the visual
  • 00:01:34
    Jam today thank you very much it's great
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    to be here a you're welcome Henrik so
  • 00:01:39
    the format of today we're going to do a
  • 00:01:41
    bit of a interview getting to know
  • 00:01:43
    Henrik at the beginning and uh then I'll
  • 00:01:46
    be passing over to Grant um who's going
  • 00:01:48
    to then quiz Henrik on uh some of the
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    great work he does especially around his
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    visual work uh and then we'll we'll kind
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    of bring in a lot more of the audience
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    participation from they on so I'm going
  • 00:02:01
    to treat this like a podcast episode
  • 00:02:03
    Henrik if you don't mind so um I'm going
  • 00:02:06
    to ask you first of all what is your
  • 00:02:07
    superpower that you bring to the
  • 00:02:10
    world oh superpower um I think what
  • 00:02:13
    other people say is my superpower is
  • 00:02:15
    ability to take complicated things and
  • 00:02:16
    explain it in a simple way so I'm going
  • 00:02:18
    to go with that nice nice and I think a
  • 00:02:22
    lot of people on the call today are
  • 00:02:23
    probably also hoping that they can build
  • 00:02:26
    that superpower especially uh the visual
  • 00:02:28
    thinkers amongst us
  • 00:02:30
    so in terms of yourself and your
  • 00:02:34
    background Henrik take me back to a
  • 00:02:36
    10-year-old Henrik what was he like and
  • 00:02:40
    what dreams and aspirations did he have
  • 00:02:42
    10 year-old Henrik lived in Tokyo liked
  • 00:02:44
    to ride his bike
  • 00:02:46
    around um I'm not sure if I'd gotten
  • 00:02:48
    into computers yet by then but maybe uh
  • 00:02:51
    I was pretty early into hacking
  • 00:02:53
    computers having having a lot of fun
  • 00:02:54
    well not hacking but tinkering with with
  • 00:02:56
    computers and banging on the piano
  • 00:02:58
    sometimes that that was pretty much much
  • 00:03:00
    me wow and you mentioned Tokyo did you
  • 00:03:03
    say yeah I grew up there I lived 16
  • 00:03:05
    years as a kid in Tokyo before moving to
  • 00:03:07
    here seden wow tell us a little bit
  • 00:03:10
    about Tokyo because I have a friend over
  • 00:03:11
    there and just just Japan generally like
  • 00:03:14
    the culture is very different to many
  • 00:03:16
    other oh yeah live living in I mostly I
  • 00:03:18
    was in Japan during the most of the year
  • 00:03:19
    and then Sweden during the Summers so
  • 00:03:21
    these cultures are very different so it
  • 00:03:22
    was quite interesting um but yeah Tokyo
  • 00:03:26
    big city uh noisy but kind of clean for
  • 00:03:29
    being a big city very little crime rate
  • 00:03:31
    friendly people and very
  • 00:03:33
    chaotic nice nice and the education
  • 00:03:36
    system is very different as well I
  • 00:03:38
    believe it's very different but I didn't
  • 00:03:40
    attend Japanese schools I attended uh an
  • 00:03:42
    American School in Japan so I don't I
  • 00:03:44
    have don't a firsthand experience of the
  • 00:03:46
    Japanese education system got it and
  • 00:03:50
    what did you want to be when you grew up
  • 00:03:51
    like I'm guessing it was something to do
  • 00:03:53
    with computers because you were
  • 00:03:54
    tinkering with I like tinkering with
  • 00:03:55
    computers but originally I was planning
  • 00:03:57
    to be a musician actually um because I
  • 00:03:59
    like tinkering with instruments as well
  • 00:04:00
    I'm in my home studio it's it's I'm
  • 00:04:02
    surrounded by instruments here oh wow
  • 00:04:05
    you got a whole BN there yeah yeah uh
  • 00:04:07
    but at some point I decided that I want
  • 00:04:09
    to play music for fun I don't want to
  • 00:04:10
    have to feel the pressure of making an
  • 00:04:11
    income out of it so then I decided that
  • 00:04:14
    maybe computers and programming could be
  • 00:04:15
    my source of income and then I could
  • 00:04:17
    play music just for fun so that's kind
  • 00:04:18
    of what I do oh nice nice I love that
  • 00:04:22
    and is that important for you to have
  • 00:04:24
    that balance between having a sort of a
  • 00:04:27
    the Arts and some of the more kind of
  • 00:04:29
    hardcore work that you do which is kind
  • 00:04:32
    of predominantly Tech definitely like
  • 00:04:34
    way my brain never stops thinking about
  • 00:04:36
    stuff and it drives me crazy so the only
  • 00:04:38
    way to get my brain to shut up is to you
  • 00:04:40
    know get occupied with something so if
  • 00:04:42
    I'm playing piano or something then I'm
  • 00:04:43
    I'm I'm being kind of mindful and
  • 00:04:45
    present so that that's great I need that
  • 00:04:48
    escape got it and so tell me a little
  • 00:04:52
    bit about your career then from then on
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    in so when you moved to Sweden like what
  • 00:04:58
    happened then in terms of your
  • 00:05:00
    job situation so came to Sweden went to
  • 00:05:02
    boarding school and then like I said
  • 00:05:05
    decided to not be a musician instead
  • 00:05:06
    become a programmer so I studied at at
  • 00:05:08
    at Royal Institute of Technology here in
  • 00:05:10
    Stockholm basically computer science and
  • 00:05:13
    this was during the.com boom so a lot of
  • 00:05:15
    you know companies were starting up and
  • 00:05:17
    I got kind of dragged into that whole
  • 00:05:18
    Whirlwind um so I went from being a
  • 00:05:21
    programmer and a consultant to being an
  • 00:05:22
    entrepreneur and as some of the
  • 00:05:24
    companies I was involved with grew then
  • 00:05:25
    I kind of stumbled into being a manager
  • 00:05:28
    and that's kind of how I learned
  • 00:05:30
    you know about about product development
  • 00:05:33
    from a bunch of different perspectives
  • 00:05:34
    by basically being pushed off a cliff a
  • 00:05:35
    few
  • 00:05:36
    times got it and was your one of your
  • 00:05:41
    first major roles was that at Spotify
  • 00:05:44
    did you start off there or was that Lego
  • 00:05:46
    I'm trying to remember just just looking
  • 00:05:48
    back so I was involved in a few pretty
  • 00:05:51
    much unknown startups during that period
  • 00:05:53
    and then as I learned um I started
  • 00:05:55
    sharing knowledge through articles and
  • 00:05:57
    videos and then Spotify was just one of
  • 00:06:00
    the clients that I ended up with but it
  • 00:06:01
    was a company that I stayed with a long
  • 00:06:02
    time and I was there quite early so it
  • 00:06:04
    was a very interesting Journey um but
  • 00:06:06
    but my kind of career as kind of
  • 00:06:09
    coaching which is what I've been doing
  • 00:06:10
    for a long a big part of my career
  • 00:06:12
    started a lot earlier than than Spotify
  • 00:06:15
    it's just that I think Spotify is what
  • 00:06:16
    most people know about since I made a
  • 00:06:17
    video about what was going on going on
  • 00:06:19
    there yeah and about five million people
  • 00:06:21
    on the planet have watched it so yeah
  • 00:06:23
    I'm sure we we all know about that and
  • 00:06:25
    we'll post some links to those videos uh
  • 00:06:27
    in in a short while so people who
  • 00:06:29
    haven't come across your work can check
  • 00:06:31
    it out I'm really interested to know
  • 00:06:34
    your sort of some of your experiences at
  • 00:06:37
    Spotify because I think a lot of us we
  • 00:06:39
    hear all of these amazing stories about
  • 00:06:41
    you know how we should be using the
  • 00:06:43
    Spotify model um when we're when we're
  • 00:06:46
    sort of trying to implement ways of
  • 00:06:48
    working such as agile
  • 00:06:50
    but could you tell us a bit more about
  • 00:06:53
    the early days of Spotify like was it
  • 00:06:55
    literally like a handful of people sat
  • 00:06:56
    in a room or you know was it more than
  • 00:06:58
    that pretty pretty much your standard
  • 00:07:00
    startup a bunch of swedes at at my
  • 00:07:02
    University got together and decided to
  • 00:07:04
    revolutionize the music industry being
  • 00:07:06
    being the naive idiots that all
  • 00:07:07
    entrepreneurs have to be otherwise no
  • 00:07:08
    companies get started so everyone said
  • 00:07:10
    that's that's a stupid idea you can't
  • 00:07:11
    change the whole music industry so they
  • 00:07:13
    went ahead and just did it anyway which
  • 00:07:15
    is kind of cool and I was lucky to get
  • 00:07:16
    involved pretty early um and what was
  • 00:07:19
    interesting to me was that it the
  • 00:07:20
    company was born into agile from the
  • 00:07:22
    beginning I never had to convince anyone
  • 00:07:23
    I never had to transform the company
  • 00:07:25
    they had an agile mindset pretty much
  • 00:07:27
    from the get-go and I was happy to have
  • 00:07:29
    a chance to kind kind of contribute to
  • 00:07:30
    that so my job there was just to help us
  • 00:07:32
    figure out how to scale with this as we
  • 00:07:33
    grew and how do we manage now that we
  • 00:07:35
    got you know multiple teams or even
  • 00:07:37
    hundreds of of
  • 00:07:38
    teams nice but yeah to be clear I've
  • 00:07:40
    never told anyone anywhere that they
  • 00:07:42
    should be using the Spotify
  • 00:07:44
    [Laughter]
  • 00:07:46
    model yeah I I I've seen a few blogs
  • 00:07:48
    about that where people have tried to um
  • 00:07:51
    dissuade people from using it and uh and
  • 00:07:54
    they still go ahead and and well I
  • 00:07:55
    wouldn't say that either I just say you
  • 00:07:57
    know do whatever works for you and
  • 00:07:59
    Spotify is one example of one company so
  • 00:08:01
    if if some of the stuff we were doing
  • 00:08:02
    inspires you then then then steal that
  • 00:08:05
    take the best bits and then adapt it to
  • 00:08:06
    your context I mean that that that's
  • 00:08:09
    kind of what we were doing um at Spotify
  • 00:08:11
    great and I I I'm just looking at the
  • 00:08:13
    chat as well so I'll crowdsource a few
  • 00:08:15
    questions as we go along and Pedro is
  • 00:08:17
    asking what what kind of company is
  • 00:08:18
    Spotify to work for like What's the
  • 00:08:20
    culture like there so I I I haven't been
  • 00:08:23
    there for like six years I have friends
  • 00:08:24
    that are still there but I can only
  • 00:08:25
    speak to when I was there um and I
  • 00:08:28
    thought it was kind of amazing um really
  • 00:08:30
    one of the most um kind of cool and fun
  • 00:08:32
    cultures I've ever worked at it was it
  • 00:08:34
    was just interesting and that's why I
  • 00:08:36
    decided to write about it because there
  • 00:08:37
    was there was something interesting
  • 00:08:38
    going on there I'm not exactly sure how
  • 00:08:40
    it came to be but U it was definitely a
  • 00:08:42
    different culture um some of it maybe
  • 00:08:45
    was changed and a little bit lost as as
  • 00:08:47
    as it grew which often happens with
  • 00:08:48
    companies as they get big but yeah I
  • 00:08:51
    thought it was quite quite a really
  • 00:08:52
    interesting
  • 00:08:53
    company and I mean thinking about times
  • 00:08:57
    back then you had Apple who had you know
  • 00:09:00
    the their kind of Apple Store and the
  • 00:09:02
    and and and all the kind of the music um
  • 00:09:05
    side of things and I guess you know H
  • 00:09:08
    how did they compete with these these
  • 00:09:10
    big players in the market and what what
  • 00:09:12
    was their secret to that in the
  • 00:09:14
    beginning it was very simple they didn't
  • 00:09:15
    need to compete because everyone thought
  • 00:09:16
    Spotify were idiots doing something that
  • 00:09:18
    that shouldn't be done it can't be done
  • 00:09:20
    so nobody was bothering to compete with
  • 00:09:21
    Spotify because they're obviously going
  • 00:09:22
    to fail um but then after a while
  • 00:09:25
    suddenly it turned out that actually
  • 00:09:26
    spotify's idea of having people stream
  • 00:09:29
    music instead of owning music and you
  • 00:09:31
    know consuming music online instead of
  • 00:09:33
    buying CDs that crazy idea turned out
  • 00:09:35
    actually to be a good idea and people
  • 00:09:37
    loved it and it became huge so then the
  • 00:09:39
    competitors woke up Google and apple and
  • 00:09:41
    all these companies that started chasing
  • 00:09:42
    after Spotify so then of course that
  • 00:09:44
    created a bit of a panic and everyone
  • 00:09:45
    asked B if I was like ah no we we got to
  • 00:09:48
    be faster than ever but but I would say
  • 00:09:51
    um a lot of it boiled down to Spotify at
  • 00:09:54
    the time had less money less people less
  • 00:09:56
    resources less everything than their
  • 00:09:57
    competitors but the one thing they had
  • 00:09:59
    was an incredibly strong culture and a
  • 00:10:01
    very very you know um and a culture
  • 00:10:04
    optimized for Speed of innovation and
  • 00:10:06
    speed of iteration which meant they
  • 00:10:08
    could pretty much out agile their
  • 00:10:10
    competitors and I think that's really
  • 00:10:11
    what what helped them win and would you
  • 00:10:14
    say that was due to the structures they
  • 00:10:16
    had in place or the the fluid structures
  • 00:10:19
    or or what what is that secret Source
  • 00:10:22
    because I I hear sort of other
  • 00:10:25
    organizations constantly trying to bring
  • 00:10:28
    that agility into their organization the
  • 00:10:30
    first thing they go for are working
  • 00:10:33
    practices yeah I think it's kind of like
  • 00:10:35
    some people think that Spotify became
  • 00:10:37
    agile because of the of the structure
  • 00:10:39
    but I think it's more like the opposite
  • 00:10:41
    the structure was created because he
  • 00:10:42
    wanted to be agile so the the mindset of
  • 00:10:46
    the management especially the the the
  • 00:10:48
    the technical leaders was really we need
  • 00:10:50
    to be really fast we need to move fast
  • 00:10:52
    and turn fast and learn faster than our
  • 00:10:54
    competitors because that's the only Edge
  • 00:10:55
    we have so by optimizing for that then
  • 00:10:58
    everything else kind of
  • 00:10:59
    so in order to move fast teams need to
  • 00:11:01
    be able to make decisions on their own
  • 00:11:02
    and not wait for for management okay
  • 00:11:04
    what do we need to have in place for
  • 00:11:04
    that to happen in order to release often
  • 00:11:06
    we need to automate everything so what
  • 00:11:09
    do we need need to do to make that
  • 00:11:10
    happen so everything kind of followed
  • 00:11:12
    from that main goal of we need to be
  • 00:11:14
    really
  • 00:11:15
    fast and then in St contrast Lego who
  • 00:11:19
    were this this larger organ yeah could
  • 00:11:23
    you tell us a bit about Lego like what
  • 00:11:25
    was that transition like for you when
  • 00:11:27
    you went there what what was the
  • 00:11:30
    I I guess lay of the land there because
  • 00:11:32
    I know Lego went through this big dip at
  • 00:11:35
    one point went out of business that was
  • 00:11:37
    kind of before my time but they uh they
  • 00:11:39
    had a crisis and came out of it and
  • 00:11:41
    learned a lot and became stronger from
  • 00:11:42
    it when I came to Lego they were really
  • 00:11:45
    open to change they had noticed they had
  • 00:11:47
    seen the Spotify stuff that I wrote
  • 00:11:49
    about and they realized that um they
  • 00:11:53
    need to change the way they work to move
  • 00:11:54
    a lot faster the world is moving too
  • 00:11:55
    fast so although Lego was really really
  • 00:11:58
    good at at things like water model and
  • 00:11:59
    traditional processes they've really
  • 00:12:01
    ironed that out they realize that being
  • 00:12:03
    good at that is not enough anymore in
  • 00:12:04
    this in this faster moving world so I
  • 00:12:07
    was very surprised how this big old
  • 00:12:09
    company was was open to trying new new
  • 00:12:12
    new ideas that was kind of fun but
  • 00:12:14
    personally it was fun for me because I
  • 00:12:15
    mostly work within software companies
  • 00:12:18
    but Lego is not a software company right
  • 00:12:21
    so software is just it's just an enabler
  • 00:12:23
    for them so it's really fun to comp to
  • 00:12:25
    come to a company and learn a lot about
  • 00:12:26
    you know how do they actually make molds
  • 00:12:28
    and how do they make these boxes how do
  • 00:12:30
    they run the factory and how can we
  • 00:12:31
    apply some thinking to other parts of
  • 00:12:33
    Lego such as their design process so
  • 00:12:35
    that was I I learned a lot from that
  • 00:12:38
    what were some of the biggest learnings
  • 00:12:39
    from that design process because I'm
  • 00:12:41
    sure um we could learn a lot from that
  • 00:12:43
    as well I think something that I kind of
  • 00:12:46
    already knew but that became even
  • 00:12:48
    stronger was when I noticed how
  • 00:12:50
    incredibly good they were at involving
  • 00:12:52
    the user um continuously in this case
  • 00:12:55
    kids so trying out models really early
  • 00:12:58
    um like even designers with 50 years of
  • 00:13:01
    experience like half a decade of
  • 00:13:02
    experience had the the the humility to
  • 00:13:06
    realize that they don't have all the
  • 00:13:07
    answers I need to be testing my models
  • 00:13:08
    all the time with real users so that
  • 00:13:10
    that was a that was a big aha for me to
  • 00:13:12
    see that kind of ingrained in the
  • 00:13:13
    culture nice and I have to ask you this
  • 00:13:17
    next question because of my son who's um
  • 00:13:19
    who's 12 and uh he absolutely loves
  • 00:13:21
    playing Minecraft so you when we spoke
  • 00:13:25
    to you pre sort of the event you
  • 00:13:28
    mentioned mentioned You' actually built
  • 00:13:30
    some features within the Minecraft game
  • 00:13:32
    like could you tell us a bit more about
  • 00:13:34
    that yeah I I probably well I worked as
  • 00:13:36
    a designers and and a developers so of
  • 00:13:38
    course I didn't build anything alone but
  • 00:13:40
    I I had a pretty core role in probably
  • 00:13:42
    about 10 or 15 different features in in
  • 00:13:44
    in the game um I guess maybe one of some
  • 00:13:46
    of the most visible ones is the terrain
  • 00:13:48
    generation we completely changed it we
  • 00:13:50
    made completely new types of caves and
  • 00:13:51
    new mountains and I spent about a year
  • 00:13:53
    working on just about only that um so
  • 00:13:56
    very very fun stuff but my my first
  • 00:13:58
    feature in Minecraft was actually the
  • 00:13:59
    Villager children um so there's little
  • 00:14:01
    kids in Minecraft they didn't do
  • 00:14:02
    anything so I I made them play so you
  • 00:14:05
    see little children chasing each other
  • 00:14:06
    and jumping on the bed and stuff then
  • 00:14:08
    that that was my my my first one oh wow
  • 00:14:11
    I'll have to look out for that I'll get
  • 00:14:12
    my son afterwards to give me a quick
  • 00:14:14
    demo and Henrik I know we don't have a a
  • 00:14:18
    lot of time for this snippet but I'd be
  • 00:14:20
    really interested to know your
  • 00:14:22
    perspective on the future of generally
  • 00:14:24
    sort of tech and product development and
  • 00:14:28
    also some of the AI stuff you're doing
  • 00:14:31
    at the moment because I believe that's
  • 00:14:33
    now that next phase of of your journey
  • 00:14:36
    yeah I I did a pretty quick pivot about
  • 00:14:38
    about a year ago when I realized that my
  • 00:14:40
    God this AI thing is changing everything
  • 00:14:41
    and I got fascinated by it so since then
  • 00:14:43
    I've worked pretty much full-time um
  • 00:14:45
    exploring how to apply this technology
  • 00:14:48
    but also Consulting with companies and
  • 00:14:49
    I'm involved in several startups and
  • 00:14:51
    basically just Dove dove in and I think
  • 00:14:54
    that's pretty much what the future of
  • 00:14:55
    tech is it really is about um embracing
  • 00:14:59
    Ai and using AI as your colleague in
  • 00:15:01
    your day-to-day work and what does that
  • 00:15:03
    mean in practice so that's kind of
  • 00:15:04
    what's being the what everyone is trying
  • 00:15:06
    to discover right
  • 00:15:07
    now and the exciting projects that
  • 00:15:10
    you're working on at the moment could
  • 00:15:11
    you give us a bit more detail about that
  • 00:15:14
    yeah I guess most recently me and some
  • 00:15:16
    friends were involved in a Swedish TV
  • 00:15:18
    documentary um about generative Ai and
  • 00:15:21
    our part in that was about AI agents and
  • 00:15:24
    an AI agent is essentially a coworker a
  • 00:15:26
    digital coworker that works autonomously
  • 00:15:28
    doesn't just sit around wait for you to
  • 00:15:29
    prompt it but it has a mission and it
  • 00:15:31
    has tools and it works alongside you
  • 00:15:33
    autonomously so we built basically a
  • 00:15:35
    digital journalist to work alongside a
  • 00:15:36
    human journalists um and they
  • 00:15:38
    collaborate on on a trailer board and
  • 00:15:40
    and create content and um it's just it's
  • 00:15:42
    been really fun so I I recently put up a
  • 00:15:45
    little demo video on our fleet. site um
  • 00:15:48
    which I guess I can put a link to um but
  • 00:15:51
    yeah so I guess my focus in like within
  • 00:15:52
    the AI field is really about uh building
  • 00:15:55
    autonomous agents or or digital
  • 00:15:57
    co-workers oh super I mean that just
  • 00:16:00
    sounds super futuristic so excited to to
  • 00:16:03
    know more about that I guess a keep part
  • 00:16:05
    of that is is my my big aha has been
  • 00:16:06
    that AI is amazing but AI plus human
  • 00:16:10
    that that's where the magic Lies when
  • 00:16:11
    humans work together with AI so that's
  • 00:16:12
    kind of the space that I'm trying to
  • 00:16:14
    zoom in on oh brilliant I'm glad you
  • 00:16:17
    finished off on that note because uh I
  • 00:16:19
    think that gives us all a sense of
  • 00:16:20
    relief which is which is great that
  • 00:16:22
    we're still needed I I think we're still
  • 00:16:26
    needed for how long I don't know but but
  • 00:16:30
    for
  • 00:16:30
    now oh brilliant well thank you so much
  • 00:16:34
    Henrik for that I'm gonna now pass over
  • 00:16:36
    to my good friend Grant and he's going
  • 00:16:38
    to take the next part of the session
  • 00:16:42
    over to you grant thanks Paddy well i'
  • 00:16:45
    been really interested to to hear your
  • 00:16:48
    background and and what an amazing
  • 00:16:50
    journey you've been on um Henrik but I
  • 00:16:53
    think the bit that that caused me to get
  • 00:16:55
    in touch with you and and kind of chance
  • 00:16:58
    my arm at if you join us on on the
  • 00:17:00
    visual Jam was um was really how I you
  • 00:17:05
    CAU my attention by using visuals to
  • 00:17:08
    explain things you talked about the
  • 00:17:10
    Spotify model and I remember seeing a
  • 00:17:13
    video you did agile product ownership in
  • 00:17:15
    a nutshell which which really simplified
  • 00:17:19
    the explanation of how agile works from
  • 00:17:20
    a product owner perspective from my I've
  • 00:17:23
    shared that so many times with people to
  • 00:17:25
    just say well if you want to know what
  • 00:17:27
    what product ownership is just go and
  • 00:17:28
    watch that and then we'll have a
  • 00:17:30
    conversation so um that's the bit that I
  • 00:17:32
    wanted to kind of De dive a bit um
  • 00:17:34
    deeper into in in this session really so
  • 00:17:37
    I wondered if you could maybe share with
  • 00:17:39
    us some of the
  • 00:17:40
    examples that you've produced in in the
  • 00:17:43
    past and kind of maybe let the uh the
  • 00:17:45
    audience see some of the the types of
  • 00:17:47
    visuals that that I'm talking about cool
  • 00:17:50
    is this where we start sharing the
  • 00:17:51
    mirror board I guess yeah yeah if you
  • 00:17:53
    could so uh let me uh so yeah we did a
  • 00:17:55
    bit a bit of very very last minute prep
  • 00:17:57
    here and very pictures into a
  • 00:18:00
    board so uh um I'll share my whole
  • 00:18:03
    screen so I'll be sharing some other
  • 00:18:04
    stuff I guess as well right um so share
  • 00:18:08
    screen um desktop one there we
  • 00:18:12
    go so uh yeah um here are some examples
  • 00:18:16
    um that uh I think Grant and Patty put
  • 00:18:19
    up just now
  • 00:18:21
    um and I don't know what I should say
  • 00:18:23
    about them
  • 00:18:25
    um I have some links below to where they
  • 00:18:28
    interested to kind of just talk us
  • 00:18:29
    through a couple of them Henry can
  • 00:18:31
    explain kind of why you use the visuals
  • 00:18:34
    why did you find the need to create a
  • 00:18:35
    visual for example on explaining MVPs
  • 00:18:37
    right so um people are wired differently
  • 00:18:41
    the way I I'm wired is I I cannot think
  • 00:18:43
    without drawing essentially um so if I'm
  • 00:18:46
    trying to explain something to myself or
  • 00:18:48
    to someone else I need a whiteboard or
  • 00:18:50
    piece of paper and I need to draw and
  • 00:18:52
    only then does it become clear in my
  • 00:18:53
    head um so this is just the result of
  • 00:18:57
    that and I think these pictures are than
  • 00:18:59
    these are not representative because
  • 00:19:00
    normally when I'm drawing it's looks
  • 00:19:02
    more like you know I I have a draw
  • 00:19:05
    drawing tablet here it's more like you
  • 00:19:06
    know like
  • 00:19:08
    that and like there's the car it's it's
  • 00:19:12
    super ugly it's really really simple
  • 00:19:14
    because I'm just trying to convey
  • 00:19:15
    something and I have to draw while while
  • 00:19:16
    thinking about it so after a typical
  • 00:19:18
    session with me you'll have a whiteboard
  • 00:19:19
    that's just a a mess that no one can
  • 00:19:21
    understand except the people who are
  • 00:19:22
    there these pictures are a little
  • 00:19:23
    polished up because I wrote an
  • 00:19:27
    article yeah and and talk us through
  • 00:19:30
    that that one in the middle there you've
  • 00:19:31
    got a little man teaching on a pile of
  • 00:19:34
    rocks using yeah yeah so so the the
  • 00:19:37
    Spotify engineering culture video um let
  • 00:19:41
    me dig that up just just to show the
  • 00:19:42
    whole picture um Spotify engineering
  • 00:19:45
    culture uh it's actually two videos but
  • 00:19:48
    it's it's a live drawing video and all
  • 00:19:50
    my videos are tend to be live drawn like
  • 00:19:52
    like this and then at the end it ends up
  • 00:19:55
    being this big picture um which I think
  • 00:19:57
    yeah so um what I basically did there is
  • 00:20:01
    for every little part that I wanted to
  • 00:20:03
    explain I wanted to have some visual way
  • 00:20:05
    of doing it and here I wanted to explain
  • 00:20:08
    what I thought was quite fascinating at
  • 00:20:10
    Spotify which was this culture of
  • 00:20:12
    finding the minimum viable bureaucracy
  • 00:20:14
    like we need some structure but we want
  • 00:20:16
    want as little structure as possible
  • 00:20:17
    because structure can get in the way but
  • 00:20:19
    with two little structure we just get
  • 00:20:20
    chaos so I was trying to think of how do
  • 00:20:22
    I visualize that and then I thought of
  • 00:20:24
    okay we're balancing between two things
  • 00:20:26
    so I think my first stratch was pretty
  • 00:20:27
    much like uh maybe just a scale like
  • 00:20:29
    that you know like that and then here's
  • 00:20:31
    um chaos and here's bureaucracy I was
  • 00:20:34
    like okay this is boring can I make it
  • 00:20:35
    more fun and I like what is the
  • 00:20:37
    consequence of chaos what is the
  • 00:20:38
    consequence of bureaucracy and I thought
  • 00:20:40
    of if it's too bureaucratic you get kind
  • 00:20:41
    of stuck it's painful and you can't move
  • 00:20:43
    and you're stuck so I just envisioned
  • 00:20:45
    falling down into these spikes I know
  • 00:20:47
    it's kind of morbid but and then with
  • 00:20:49
    chaos you're just running around
  • 00:20:50
    fighting fires everywhere so I figured I
  • 00:20:51
    might as well and that's painful in in
  • 00:20:53
    another way so that's how I ended up
  • 00:20:55
    doing that and then I this the RIT
  • 00:20:58
    version of this was actually for a talk
  • 00:21:00
    in Paris so I drew the Eiffel Tower in
  • 00:21:02
    the first version here for that talk
  • 00:21:04
    okay but then later on when I made the
  • 00:21:05
    Spotify version I was like uh it' be
  • 00:21:08
    weird what why is the Eiffel Tower here
  • 00:21:09
    so I figured why not a pile of rock
  • 00:21:11
    because that shows the kind of uh how
  • 00:21:13
    it's not entirely stable this balance
  • 00:21:15
    and it could fall apart and I also
  • 00:21:17
    thought carefully about the fact that in
  • 00:21:18
    the video I mentioned that we prefer
  • 00:21:20
    chaos over bureaucracy so we'll never
  • 00:21:22
    find a perfect balance but if I have to
  • 00:21:23
    pick I'd rather be a little bit too far
  • 00:21:26
    this way that's why I drew this guy kind
  • 00:21:28
    of buting a little bit to the left here
  • 00:21:30
    and then I and I looked at picture after
  • 00:21:32
    a while I'm like hm what what is helping
  • 00:21:34
    us figure this out and I thought well
  • 00:21:35
    this is really a cultural thing that
  • 00:21:37
    nobody talks about this but it's kind of
  • 00:21:39
    assumed that we that we we we want to
  • 00:21:42
    find a balance and we definitely don't
  • 00:21:43
    want to be here and we'd rather be a
  • 00:21:44
    little bit more here and that's kind of
  • 00:21:46
    what the culture is so then I just added
  • 00:21:48
    this this bit bit down here so yeah
  • 00:21:50
    that's kind of the story behind that
  • 00:21:52
    picture oh that's
  • 00:21:54
    cool oh I had this that's interesting
  • 00:21:57
    was oh yeah this is interesting when I
  • 00:21:58
    came Spotify was a dinky little startup
  • 00:22:01
    and the small little startups are just
  • 00:22:02
    chaotic but then as they grew they
  • 00:22:03
    needed to add a little more structure so
  • 00:22:05
    I drew the Spotify ion and said here
  • 00:22:07
    they are on the journey towards the
  • 00:22:08
    right when I came to Lego was kind of
  • 00:22:10
    the opposite they had all this
  • 00:22:11
    bureaucracy all this structure which we
  • 00:22:12
    need to remove and simplify so they were
  • 00:22:14
    kind of too far to the right and move
  • 00:22:15
    moving to the left so I added
  • 00:22:18
    those it's really interesting how such a
  • 00:22:20
    simple visual though packs so much into
  • 00:22:24
    it and you can tell a whole story around
  • 00:22:26
    that one Visual and we all kind of
  • 00:22:28
    intuitively get it right yeah um the
  • 00:22:32
    other example you've got to the far
  • 00:22:33
    right there is is probably the bit you
  • 00:22:35
    just started to talk about towards the
  • 00:22:36
    end of that discussion with Paddy the
  • 00:22:39
    idea of embedding AI into into work do
  • 00:22:42
    you want to explain this one because I
  • 00:22:44
    like this because it's really simple
  • 00:22:45
    which yeah yeah I wrote an article just
  • 00:22:47
    just just last week um on the theme of
  • 00:22:49
    like since I've worked a lot within the
  • 00:22:51
    agile space and now focus on AI then the
  • 00:22:52
    question is what's the impact how does
  • 00:22:54
    agile change and I think it changes
  • 00:22:56
    quite a lot so I wrote an article at
  • 00:22:58
    that end as usual I need pictures about
  • 00:22:59
    every paragraph otherwise I can't even
  • 00:23:01
    sort things out of my own head these are
  • 00:23:03
    really simp this is more representative
  • 00:23:05
    these are the kind of ugly drawings I
  • 00:23:06
    normally draw very very very simple just
  • 00:23:08
    to capture this this is the vend diagram
  • 00:23:10
    of knowledge a cross functional team
  • 00:23:12
    with people and overlapping knowledge
  • 00:23:13
    and here comes AI with massive knowledge
  • 00:23:16
    but it doesn't replace all human
  • 00:23:17
    knowledge um so and what I wanted to add
  • 00:23:20
    there was my prediction and I hate
  • 00:23:21
    predicting things because they're always
  • 00:23:22
    wrong of course especially with AI but I
  • 00:23:25
    still felt the need to to share some
  • 00:23:27
    some observations and the observation
  • 00:23:29
    seems to be that teams are getting
  • 00:23:31
    smaller because when you're a when you
  • 00:23:32
    have an AI empowered team you don't
  • 00:23:34
    necessarily need all these different
  • 00:23:36
    cross functional skills because AI just
  • 00:23:38
    has this incredibly huge skill base so
  • 00:23:40
    the pattern I'm seeing is that teams are
  • 00:23:42
    getting smaller but then more numerous
  • 00:23:44
    so I wanted to capture that in one
  • 00:23:46
    picture so I was like okay here's a
  • 00:23:47
    couple of typical agile cross functional
  • 00:23:49
    teams that are typically five or six
  • 00:23:51
    people and maybe we're moving towards a
  • 00:23:53
    world where there's smaller teams and
  • 00:23:55
    each one has an AI buddy and then we
  • 00:23:58
    probably have more of those teams so
  • 00:23:59
    that's kind of what I wanted to cap
  • 00:24:01
    capture
  • 00:24:03
    there cool and um I think on the board
  • 00:24:07
    as well we've actually got a couple of
  • 00:24:08
    the example videos I think the the
  • 00:24:11
    latest one you've done is is on
  • 00:24:13
    generative AI this one yeah yeah so talk
  • 00:24:17
    us to because I because I I I loved this
  • 00:24:20
    one and I love the the kind of metaphor
  • 00:24:23
    you used of having kind of Einstein in
  • 00:24:25
    your basement that really jumps out and
  • 00:24:28
    kind of gets the point across really
  • 00:24:30
    simply in a way that you know most
  • 00:24:32
    people just intuitively get and
  • 00:24:35
    understand but talk us through the
  • 00:24:36
    process of how you went about crafting
  • 00:24:39
    this did you just start doodling did you
  • 00:24:41
    have a script beforehand how did you go
  • 00:24:43
    about doing this one so first of all I
  • 00:24:45
    can mention a funny thing about this
  • 00:24:46
    thing um we have this figure Einstein
  • 00:24:48
    the video the video again is the process
  • 00:24:50
    of me drawing this picture and I have a
  • 00:24:51
    link down here um in fact let me just
  • 00:24:53
    show a few seconds of it to get a sense
  • 00:24:55
    of what it is
  • 00:24:57
    um let's just jump in somewhere Wild
  • 00:25:00
    West just keep in mind that you
  • 00:25:02
    generally get what you pay for so with a
  • 00:25:05
    free model you may so I use the pen
  • 00:25:08
    to to point to things but also to draw
  • 00:25:12
    things I sometimes paste in pictures of
  • 00:25:15
    the technology and then a lot of live
  • 00:25:16
    drawing right poetry so uh a funny thing
  • 00:25:19
    about Einstein so I've noticed that I
  • 00:25:21
    unconsciously try to have a character in
  • 00:25:23
    my videos whenever possible and I only
  • 00:25:25
    learned recently that that's part of
  • 00:25:26
    what makes the videos engaging so in my
  • 00:25:28
    first one with product ownership in a
  • 00:25:30
    nutshell here's the first thing I say my
  • 00:25:31
    first sentence is here's Pat she's a
  • 00:25:34
    product owner let's explain things from
  • 00:25:35
    her perspective and I'm always referring
  • 00:25:37
    back to her perspective and she's kind
  • 00:25:38
    of the the the protagonist here and here
  • 00:25:41
    it's kind of by accident I think I had
  • 00:25:43
    this Einstein figure who starts over
  • 00:25:45
    here is stuck in the basement later on
  • 00:25:47
    he gets to take a walk with you and
  • 00:25:49
    later on he actually gets to uh be free
  • 00:25:51
    and go out and walk on his own with a
  • 00:25:53
    mission and own tools so and and I think
  • 00:25:56
    yeah having a some kind of protagonist
  • 00:25:57
    helps
  • 00:25:59
    but yeah the story behind this video so
  • 00:26:01
    this reflects it's funny because I get
  • 00:26:02
    this question a lot it's it's so funny
  • 00:26:04
    if you look at this video if you look at
  • 00:26:05
    the comments of the video it's
  • 00:26:07
    incredible like every I would say I do
  • 00:26:10
    read comments and about every every
  • 00:26:13
    second comment is how the hell did you
  • 00:26:14
    make the video so everyone is curious
  • 00:26:17
    about how the hell so what's the process
  • 00:26:19
    so I'm glad to finally get a little bit
  • 00:26:20
    of time to
  • 00:26:22
    explain I haven't got around to it so
  • 00:26:24
    what is the process so basically um at a
  • 00:26:28
    high level I start with um a PowerPoint
  • 00:26:32
    and that's going to be a that's going to
  • 00:26:34
    sound very boring but I start with a
  • 00:26:36
    PowerPoint and just think a little bit
  • 00:26:38
    about what what do I want to get across
  • 00:26:40
    so I'm like there's so many videos
  • 00:26:41
    explaining j i why would I make a video
  • 00:26:42
    at all I had to explain it I had to
  • 00:26:44
    convince myself to make a video I was
  • 00:26:46
    skeptical but I decided that okay I've
  • 00:26:48
    learned a lot and I want to get out get
  • 00:26:50
    it out of my head maybe I can maybe I
  • 00:26:52
    can paint the big picture so I like okay
  • 00:26:54
    handdrawn is more fun to watch um ends
  • 00:26:56
    with a picture that looks attractive
  • 00:26:58
    this was my little pitch just for myself
  • 00:27:00
    like why am i g to go off to my summer
  • 00:27:01
    Cottage and spend a week just zooming in
  • 00:27:04
    on this right so I managed to convince
  • 00:27:06
    myself that that's a good idea and this
  • 00:27:07
    was my own little pitch um and then I
  • 00:27:11
    then each I started dividing it into
  • 00:27:13
    chapters like um a chapter to me is like
  • 00:27:16
    a um a 10 10 or 20 second part of the
  • 00:27:19
    video and by the way stop if I get too
  • 00:27:21
    detailed here I don't I don't know what
  • 00:27:22
    level I should put this at but
  • 00:27:25
    essentially I I figure out one of the
  • 00:27:26
    main chapters and it just start with the
  • 00:27:28
    title of each one um and it's iterative
  • 00:27:30
    so I don't get it right in the beginning
  • 00:27:32
    I go back and change it over and over
  • 00:27:34
    again I spent about a couple of days
  • 00:27:36
    obsessing over the script because one
  • 00:27:38
    thing I've learned is that a video
  • 00:27:39
    shouldn't be long um and with my product
  • 00:27:42
    ownership video it's a 15minute video
  • 00:27:45
    that corresponds to about two days of
  • 00:27:47
    training so I got to condense it to an
  • 00:27:49
    insane level which means every word
  • 00:27:51
    matters so when I start looking at what
  • 00:27:54
    am I going to say here I write something
  • 00:27:57
    and then I change it and I change it and
  • 00:27:58
    I change it like so many times until
  • 00:28:00
    it's as short as it possibly can be and
  • 00:28:02
    then I count the words and I stick stick
  • 00:28:05
    it into a very perimeter spreadsheet
  • 00:28:07
    called
  • 00:28:08
    timings and I just WR how many words was
  • 00:28:11
    it I I use a tool to count it I don't
  • 00:28:13
    count it by hand but I stick how many
  • 00:28:15
    words because I've learned historically
  • 00:28:16
    how many how many words I speak per
  • 00:28:18
    second 2.8 words per
  • 00:28:20
    second if I speak faster than that I
  • 00:28:23
    lose everyone so that's really too fast
  • 00:28:25
    even then but so I basically this gives
  • 00:28:28
    me a budget the video should ideally be
  • 00:28:30
    15 minutes at most so I have a budget of
  • 00:28:32
    2525 words and I'm going to do my best
  • 00:28:35
    to keep the video to that length so
  • 00:28:36
    that's kind of my my constraint that I
  • 00:28:38
    try to enforce on myself and then I and
  • 00:28:40
    then I also um for each little section I
  • 00:28:43
    start thinking about what's going to be
  • 00:28:44
    my visual so here's an ugly draft I want
  • 00:28:46
    to I'm talking about computers can all
  • 00:28:48
    think in the past they just executed
  • 00:28:49
    scripts so maybe I can use a metaphor
  • 00:28:51
    for that a calculator it's just executes
  • 00:28:53
    instructions so maybe I maybe I have a
  • 00:28:55
    calculator here and a bit of code so I
  • 00:28:57
    just kind of put a little dra drawing
  • 00:28:58
    here's another example of of Ven diagram
  • 00:29:00
    of how different AI Technologies fit
  • 00:29:02
    together just quickly draw something
  • 00:29:03
    ugly here sometimes I copy paste stuff
  • 00:29:05
    from a slide here this was from a slide
  • 00:29:07
    that I I used in some presentation so
  • 00:29:09
    what am I going to say what am I going
  • 00:29:10
    to draw roughly I'm then to obsess over
  • 00:29:13
    this for a couple of days back and forth
  • 00:29:15
    back and forth and for this video I
  • 00:29:17
    actually used GPT to help me so GPT I I
  • 00:29:20
    pasted in this stuff gave it to gp4 and
  • 00:29:23
    and asked it to help me match this goal
  • 00:29:26
    I wanted to be you know a audience I
  • 00:29:28
    want to reach both people who are new
  • 00:29:30
    and I also want to be able to reach
  • 00:29:31
    people that are experienced so I should
  • 00:29:32
    use Simple metaphors but not too simple
  • 00:29:34
    and Etc so GPT was very helpful for to
  • 00:29:37
    find the right balance and it found some
  • 00:29:39
    factual errors it suggested some
  • 00:29:41
    metaphors it's a lot more useful than
  • 00:29:42
    people realized um and and once I'm done
  • 00:29:46
    with
  • 00:29:47
    this um then I basically record and I
  • 00:29:51
    think maybe I should just demonstrate
  • 00:29:53
    that instead of just talking about it
  • 00:29:54
    what do you
  • 00:29:56
    think I see nodding great so let's say I
  • 00:29:59
    have a script here right in fact let's
  • 00:30:01
    let's let's make a video now um show and
  • 00:30:04
    tell is more fun than talking so let's
  • 00:30:05
    say here's my video script
  • 00:30:08
    okay um there was once
  • 00:30:12
    upon there needs to be a protagonist
  • 00:30:14
    right a an AI named Kenny he was sad
  • 00:30:19
    because he was alone uh one day he
  • 00:30:22
    joined a Dev team um they loved him and
  • 00:30:26
    he became happy
  • 00:30:29
    how about
  • 00:30:31
    that what do you think good story we
  • 00:30:35
    have a protagonist named Kenny cool yeah
  • 00:30:36
    so let's say I've iterated on this a lot
  • 00:30:38
    and this is my this is my script the
  • 00:30:40
    next thing I do is I just record it so I
  • 00:30:42
    use a tool called screen flow and let me
  • 00:30:44
    just be clear I'm an amateur making
  • 00:30:46
    videos is not my main job so so so this
  • 00:30:48
    is just how I happened to do it um so I
  • 00:30:51
    use a tool called screen flow which is
  • 00:30:52
    just record stuff so I'm not going to
  • 00:30:54
    I'm going to tell it now that I want to
  • 00:30:55
    record um uh there I'm going to record
  • 00:30:59
    my mic um and my why not my my my face
  • 00:31:03
    as well for some of my videos I have my
  • 00:31:05
    face in the corner for some I don't um
  • 00:31:07
    now I'm leaning towards that people like
  • 00:31:09
    seeing a little face in the corner like
  • 00:31:10
    that um it feels more human so I tend to
  • 00:31:13
    do that so microphone and and and the
  • 00:31:15
    camera okay here it
  • 00:31:20
    goes there was once upon a time an AI
  • 00:31:23
    named Kenny he was sad because he was
  • 00:31:25
    alone one day he joined a Dev team they
  • 00:31:27
    loved him and he became happy end of the
  • 00:31:29
    story
  • 00:31:32
    okay and we add it to the
  • 00:31:34
    document and there it
  • 00:31:37
    is let's try it there was once upon a
  • 00:31:41
    time an AI named Kenny he was sad
  • 00:31:43
    because he was alone one day are you
  • 00:31:45
    hearing that the video is a bit out of
  • 00:31:47
    sync but maybe it's because there's so
  • 00:31:48
    much stuff going on on my computer right
  • 00:31:50
    now you know anyway there it is then I I
  • 00:31:53
    start editing it I make it shorter I cut
  • 00:31:55
    out like empty spots like oh there's a
  • 00:31:57
    bit of empty spot there was an um there
  • 00:31:59
    was a burp there was a hiccup there's me
  • 00:32:01
    scratching my nose just go in and I just
  • 00:32:03
    shorten it um just remove stuff make it
  • 00:32:06
    as short as possible um and I listen to
  • 00:32:08
    it and and and I basically do the whole
  • 00:32:10
    thing in one take with small stops
  • 00:32:12
    because if I do too many different takes
  • 00:32:14
    it sounds weird the The Voice gets weird
  • 00:32:16
    but anyway um once I have the voice in
  • 00:32:17
    that becomes the the the skeleton and
  • 00:32:21
    then I draw and drawing is a lot more
  • 00:32:22
    slow so let's H let's do that I use a
  • 00:32:24
    program called Art
  • 00:32:25
    rage um let's start a new new
  • 00:32:29
    document
  • 00:32:30
    that um it's just the first program that
  • 00:32:32
    happened to come across I like it
  • 00:32:34
    because um um it just it's just a it's
  • 00:32:36
    just a pen it's a paintbrush and there's
  • 00:32:37
    a pen here and I use a drawing tablet u
  • 00:32:40
    in this case just a waycom drawing
  • 00:32:41
    tablet you can use any kind of drawing
  • 00:32:43
    tablet really because drawing with a
  • 00:32:45
    mouse is is really a
  • 00:32:46
    pain so uh then I have my script
  • 00:32:49
    typically on on another screen and I
  • 00:32:51
    have this here because I want to know
  • 00:32:53
    what what I was supposed to draw roughly
  • 00:32:55
    so uh I'll do a little draft on my Miro
  • 00:32:57
    I want to draw draw picture of U uh my
  • 00:32:59
    little draft is going to be there's
  • 00:33:00
    going to be a robot here who's sad and
  • 00:33:03
    then there's going to be a team over
  • 00:33:04
    there um and then he joins a team and
  • 00:33:06
    everybody's happy or something like that
  • 00:33:07
    okay cool and once I once I've made an
  • 00:33:10
    ugly draft of that um in fact Let me
  • 00:33:12
    show my original draft for the for the
  • 00:33:14
    video um where is it yeah this is my gen
  • 00:33:17
    Ai and a nutshell draft let's look at it
  • 00:33:20
    there right very simple it's just
  • 00:33:23
    Scrolls but this is where I iterate on
  • 00:33:25
    what's going to go where in the picture
  • 00:33:27
    right cuz I need to have that figured
  • 00:33:28
    out in advance is this going to go over
  • 00:33:29
    here does that fit over here is this
  • 00:33:31
    going to refer to that one so I do a lot
  • 00:33:32
    of iterating on this moving things
  • 00:33:33
    around until I'm happy with it then I
  • 00:33:36
    start recording so let's say I've done
  • 00:33:38
    that I've iterated I know what roughly
  • 00:33:39
    what I'm going to draw and we go back to
  • 00:33:41
    uh screen
  • 00:33:42
    flow and we go I want to record
  • 00:33:46
    again um and this time I don't want to
  • 00:33:50
    record talking I want to record my
  • 00:33:54
    screen so let's see there we go I'll
  • 00:33:58
    take a black pen and I'll say and and
  • 00:34:01
    here I'm thinking about the script I've
  • 00:34:02
    been drawing so there's this AI here
  • 00:34:05
    right who's a bit sad because he's all
  • 00:34:06
    alone um and there's his antenna and
  • 00:34:10
    then one day he decides to join a team
  • 00:34:12
    now it's being very laggy because all
  • 00:34:14
    stuff going on on my computer so that's
  • 00:34:15
    why the lines are even extra ugly like
  • 00:34:18
    that and then I like to add a little bit
  • 00:34:20
    of color so I add a second layer here um
  • 00:34:23
    and just add a bit of color um so let's
  • 00:34:27
    just do a bit of that oh let's bit of
  • 00:34:30
    gray and I'm not in a hurry here I can
  • 00:34:32
    addit this later right um I do a lot of
  • 00:34:34
    retakes when I mess things
  • 00:34:36
    up um I'm trying to make it not too
  • 00:34:38
    pretty because it'll just take forever
  • 00:34:39
    and it's not important for the message
  • 00:34:42
    but let's say here's a team here of
  • 00:34:43
    people and maybe I sometimes use this
  • 00:34:46
    thing to um um a bit of white here just
  • 00:34:49
    to kind of splatter out the color a
  • 00:34:51
    little bit
  • 00:34:53
    um right there's a bit of color and
  • 00:34:56
    maybe a bit of shading Etc you kind of
  • 00:34:58
    get the point so just a little bit not
  • 00:35:00
    not too much decoration I don't want
  • 00:35:01
    this become a masterpiece work ofar it's
  • 00:35:02
    just it's a sketch but something like
  • 00:35:04
    that right and then of course he became
  • 00:35:05
    happy so uh let's erase his sad face um
  • 00:35:10
    and uh
  • 00:35:13
    um there and he's happy and actually
  • 00:35:16
    he's part of this team so I I drew this
  • 00:35:18
    circle wrong so in real life I would
  • 00:35:20
    have stopped now I would have
  • 00:35:20
    re-recorded because the circle is
  • 00:35:22
    supposed to go around all of them right
  • 00:35:23
    but I won't do that now so um stop
  • 00:35:26
    recording
  • 00:35:28
    and add
  • 00:35:29
    it there it is um what the hell oh wait
  • 00:35:34
    that was later yeah cool there so
  • 00:35:35
    there's my drawing and um I would need
  • 00:35:37
    to figure I would take my face here and
  • 00:35:40
    just edit it really so it's okay my face
  • 00:35:42
    needs to be smaller and here's my
  • 00:35:44
    drawing and I'll I'll be speeding up
  • 00:35:46
    speeding it up a lot so there's all
  • 00:35:48
    these shortcut keys out and pull will
  • 00:35:50
    basically just speed it up so I'll just
  • 00:35:52
    go like that I'm speeding up like a
  • 00:35:55
    lot and um um
  • 00:35:59
    there we go and I'll be I'll be cutting
  • 00:36:01
    sections and stuff like that and you
  • 00:36:02
    know zooming in and stuff time and AI um
  • 00:36:06
    oh yeah let me just set the size of this
  • 00:36:08
    to the same there we
  • 00:36:10
    go there was once upon a time an AI
  • 00:36:13
    named Kenny he was sad because he was
  • 00:36:15
    alone one day he joined a Dev team they
  • 00:36:17
    loved him and he became happy end of
  • 00:36:19
    story yeah so that plus two hours of me
  • 00:36:23
    fiddling around with this drawing part
  • 00:36:25
    to make the drawing fit in time with the
  • 00:36:28
    speaking that's
  • 00:36:30
    it it's a pain it takes a long time but
  • 00:36:33
    it but but the results are nice yeah the
  • 00:36:36
    results the results are great there's a
  • 00:36:38
    few people asking about the the tool and
  • 00:36:41
    are you using the tablet right now so
  • 00:36:43
    you're using a is it a Wacom tablet
  • 00:36:46
    you're
  • 00:36:47
    using Wacom and a
  • 00:36:50
    pen there you go i' I've tried using
  • 00:36:53
    various iPad apps but the combination of
  • 00:36:55
    being able to draw and record and edit
  • 00:36:58
    it just iPad just doesn't work I need to
  • 00:37:00
    have a computer with a proper program
  • 00:37:01
    and a proper recording program like
  • 00:37:03
    screen flow so for a while I tried to
  • 00:37:05
    move switch tools I'm like this is this
  • 00:37:06
    is not modern using a drawing tablet and
  • 00:37:08
    computer that's like so 2000 you know
  • 00:37:10
    I'm going to get an iPad and be one of
  • 00:37:11
    the cool kids but no I went back this
  • 00:37:14
    works a lot better so so with the screen
  • 00:37:16
    for you're using that to record both the
  • 00:37:19
    audio and the video but also and also
  • 00:37:22
    edit afterwards so I can go in here and
  • 00:37:24
    I can say that I want to zoom in a
  • 00:37:25
    little bit um in fact I zoom in a lot uh
  • 00:37:28
    I don't want to see all the stuff on the
  • 00:37:29
    sides right so I'll zoom in and just
  • 00:37:31
    show this part and I and I'll be
  • 00:37:33
    scrolling around um in here move around
  • 00:37:35
    the canvas kind of thing yeah and you
  • 00:37:38
    can you can you can record like
  • 00:37:40
    movements I can say that over here it
  • 00:37:41
    should U um let's say action uh and we
  • 00:37:45
    say it should scroll over here right and
  • 00:37:48
    now when I play it it moved right so
  • 00:37:51
    just fiddling around but it it takes
  • 00:37:53
    about um when I'm when I'm at this step
  • 00:37:55
    drawing a recording I'll calculate it to
  • 00:37:57
    my dismay that it took about 2 hours per
  • 00:37:59
    one minute of
  • 00:38:01
    video uh and that the whole video took
  • 00:38:03
    me about 60 hours in total including
  • 00:38:05
    everything um so it people sometimes get
  • 00:38:07
    surprised because they think it looks
  • 00:38:08
    kind of effortless like I'm just
  • 00:38:09
    standing there talking and moving the
  • 00:38:10
    pen but every damn thing is is a mini
  • 00:38:13
    project even like oh I talked about X
  • 00:38:16
    and I want to move the pen to point to
  • 00:38:17
    that while I talk about it okay back to
  • 00:38:19
    screen flow record me moving my pen from
  • 00:38:21
    that part to that part put it back in
  • 00:38:22
    edit it so everything it's a bloody pain
  • 00:38:25
    and I'm sure there's going to be a
  • 00:38:26
    better ways to do this in the future
  • 00:38:27
    future but right now this is this is
  • 00:38:28
    what I
  • 00:38:30
    got I mean like you said though the
  • 00:38:33
    result speaks for itself you know almost
  • 00:38:35
    a million views on that AI video and uh
  • 00:38:39
    and genuinely it it it brings to life
  • 00:38:42
    the explanation I think the fact it's
  • 00:38:44
    interesting to seeing that he did the
  • 00:38:45
    script first You' you've thought about
  • 00:38:48
    the narrative the and the story we had
  • 00:38:51
    um Lee Le fever who was the author of
  • 00:38:54
    The Art of explanation is a guest on the
  • 00:38:56
    visual a while back he produces expl
  • 00:39:00
    explainer videos um in a Sim vein and um
  • 00:39:04
    he does exactly the same thing he starts
  • 00:39:06
    with the script he he calculates how
  • 00:39:09
    many words how long a word will take all
  • 00:39:11
    the things you were describing he pretty
  • 00:39:13
    much does the same things I think I
  • 00:39:15
    think the key thing there is like I
  • 00:39:17
    could improvise this talk I do it quite
  • 00:39:18
    often I do live talks but then it takes
  • 00:39:20
    me an
  • 00:39:21
    hour so so so scripting every word is
  • 00:39:24
    necessary when you want something to be
  • 00:39:25
    really short then you need to think
  • 00:39:27
    about every word you can't improvise it
  • 00:39:29
    anymore
  • 00:39:32
    absolutely okay um so py are there any
  • 00:39:35
    other questions in the in the
  • 00:39:39
    chat good good question sorry you caught
  • 00:39:41
    me off guard there um let me see I I
  • 00:39:45
    would say if folks just put up their
  • 00:39:47
    hands we can do a bit of a Q&A because
  • 00:39:49
    um I'll I'll probably miss some some
  • 00:39:52
    questions so if you want to raise your
  • 00:39:53
    hand so is that Leah who's had hand
  • 00:39:58
    hey yeah um what makes the videos
  • 00:40:02
    viral what what makes the videos viral
  • 00:40:05
    viral I think that's the title of this
  • 00:40:09
    talk I would love to hear your I have no
  • 00:40:11
    idea honestly well I I have ideas but
  • 00:40:14
    I'm sure you too I'm No Authority on
  • 00:40:16
    that really um what what what do you
  • 00:40:20
    think
  • 00:40:22
    um what makes the video viral I I'm
  • 00:40:25
    asking you because it was your title
  • 00:40:29
    um okay you posted these on YouTube um
  • 00:40:34
    yeah look at the number of views would
  • 00:40:37
    that tell us um yeah this
  • 00:40:41
    one this one is my first one what
  • 00:40:44
    surprises me is it's quite old now and
  • 00:40:46
    yet it's still like growing like
  • 00:40:50
    incredibly fast oh wait adop
  • 00:40:52
    nutshell just just just the Google
  • 00:40:54
    ranking right um and then it's it's to I
  • 00:40:57
    made it
  • 00:40:58
    2012 and it's up it's up to 4.2 million
  • 00:41:01
    views and it just keeps growing
  • 00:41:03
    spreading and the one I just added this
  • 00:41:05
    one I just added a month ago and it's
  • 00:41:06
    already up up to a million almost or two
  • 00:41:08
    months ago why why do you think it's
  • 00:41:11
    become
  • 00:41:13
    viral is I have I have I I have some
  • 00:41:17
    theories um because every one of these
  • 00:41:19
    animated videos did become viral to to
  • 00:41:21
    different extents and I made a lot of
  • 00:41:23
    other types of things articles and stuff
  • 00:41:26
    that have not become as viral so
  • 00:41:28
    something about this format appeals to
  • 00:41:30
    people so I think it's a combination of
  • 00:41:32
    the fact that I don't make them very
  • 00:41:33
    often when I make them it's a topic I've
  • 00:41:35
    thought about a lot so content-wise I
  • 00:41:38
    think it's quite well thought out and
  • 00:41:39
    it's also content that I've had a had
  • 00:41:40
    time to iterate on like I've been
  • 00:41:42
    teaching people stuff running courses
  • 00:41:43
    doing talks so by the time I make the
  • 00:41:45
    video I already have a clear message and
  • 00:41:47
    a clear way of explaining it so that
  • 00:41:49
    that pre-work I think is is a important
  • 00:41:51
    part of it because I could have the
  • 00:41:52
    exact same format but if but if the
  • 00:41:55
    content isn't that good I don't think
  • 00:41:56
    the format will will help it won't cover
  • 00:41:57
    up for that the second thing I think is
  • 00:42:00
    something about drawing physical because
  • 00:42:03
    I had some other videos where I got lazy
  • 00:42:04
    I just did like PowerPoint slides with
  • 00:42:06
    animations but content wise I would say
  • 00:42:08
    the quality would would be similar but
  • 00:42:10
    in no nowhere near the same level of of
  • 00:42:12
    of popularity so I think there's
  • 00:42:14
    something about seeing a pen and that
  • 00:42:16
    pen is poting to things and it's and
  • 00:42:18
    it's drawing while speaking maybe that
  • 00:42:20
    just appeals to to human nature somehow
  • 00:42:22
    um those are some of my theories no
  • 00:42:25
    that's brilliant thank you
  • 00:42:29
    and Ju Just just for the record folks it
  • 00:42:32
    was um our idea to call the session how
  • 00:42:35
    to make your video go viral not henrix
  • 00:42:38
    so uh just just to put that out there um
  • 00:42:40
    but the fact is yeah as you can see you
  • 00:42:42
    know millions of views so people
  • 00:42:44
    absolutely love those videos and um
  • 00:42:47
    myself you know coming from a agile
  • 00:42:49
    training background first thing I do on
  • 00:42:51
    a product owner course is put that video
  • 00:42:53
    on it's a great way to set the scene and
  • 00:42:55
    and I don't even have to say anything to
  • 00:42:57
    be honest it just I actually kind of do
  • 00:42:59
    the same when I teach atro courses I say
  • 00:43:00
    watch this video first that gets the
  • 00:43:02
    main content out of the way then we can
  • 00:43:03
    just spend the rest of the course
  • 00:43:04
    zooming in on the details so saes time
  • 00:43:07
    yeah so thank you Henrik you made my
  • 00:43:09
    life so much easier I can go for a
  • 00:43:10
    coffee break yeah brilliant um next in
  • 00:43:14
    line I think is Adam Adam would you like
  • 00:43:15
    to come off from you sure yeah thanks so
  • 00:43:19
    much Henrik for coming and speaking to
  • 00:43:22
    us and kind of showcasing that that was
  • 00:43:24
    brilliant and I just want to say that
  • 00:43:26
    when I pivoted into product I was
  • 00:43:29
    frustrated at the lack of uh uh decent
  • 00:43:33
    explanation for what a what the sort of
  • 00:43:37
    operational um process of a product
  • 00:43:39
    manager was and your video was the thing
  • 00:43:41
    that really solidified it and I think
  • 00:43:43
    it's because probably similar to you I
  • 00:43:45
    think in visual metaphor and I and to me
  • 00:43:49
    that's what is so appealing to your
  • 00:43:51
    videos is it's like having a
  • 00:43:53
    conversation a visual conversation with
  • 00:43:56
    someone else like in real time um it's
  • 00:43:58
    not just like a meme but it's sort of
  • 00:44:00
    like an interactive meme if that makes
  • 00:44:02
    sense or resonates but my question to
  • 00:44:04
    you is
  • 00:44:06
    um uh really just you know was there a
  • 00:44:09
    moment in your life where you discovered
  • 00:44:11
    like hey this drawing thing is really
  • 00:44:14
    like it really helps me uh Focus my own
  • 00:44:18
    thoughts and my own thinking was it
  • 00:44:20
    something that you know you learned in
  • 00:44:23
    like a particular experience or was it
  • 00:44:25
    like a work thing or something that you
  • 00:44:26
    learn in school I'm just kind of curious
  • 00:44:29
    like what um like where that came from
  • 00:44:31
    or where that started right yeah like I
  • 00:44:34
    I dug up my old high school notebooks
  • 00:44:35
    just for fun from the attic that like a
  • 00:44:37
    few years ago just stumbled over them by
  • 00:44:38
    accident and I found my notebooks and I
  • 00:44:41
    saw like oh this was apparently a
  • 00:44:43
    notebook from a math lesson and I see
  • 00:44:45
    like a tiny bit of math in the corner
  • 00:44:48
    and the rest is just
  • 00:44:49
    Doodles typically meet drawing
  • 00:44:51
    caricatures of the teacher so I think
  • 00:44:54
    that kind of just became a um a bit of
  • 00:44:56
    an obsession just drawing um but then
  • 00:44:58
    when the connection to work came I guess
  • 00:45:00
    later I did a lot of role playing during
  • 00:45:02
    high school and then I I like to draw
  • 00:45:04
    stuff it it it helped shape the campaign
  • 00:45:06
    and help you know generate a good
  • 00:45:08
    atmosphere when you had a drawing of
  • 00:45:09
    something but but I'm not an artist I I
  • 00:45:11
    don't make these beautiful pictures it's
  • 00:45:12
    quite simple and again the pictures on
  • 00:45:14
    the board are not I'm not this good at
  • 00:45:16
    drawing these are like these are the the
  • 00:45:17
    prettified version I'm really not an
  • 00:45:19
    artist this is more representative of my
  • 00:45:21
    style right simple stick figures but
  • 00:45:24
    when I started getting to work life I
  • 00:45:26
    think I know I gradually notice that
  • 00:45:28
    when I get up in front of a whiteboard
  • 00:45:30
    to visualize what I'm thinking right now
  • 00:45:32
    or visualize what what the what the room
  • 00:45:33
    is talking about I Did It For My Own
  • 00:45:35
    sake but I noticed that others it it
  • 00:45:37
    made the whole room more aligned people
  • 00:45:39
    just seem to get more smarter and more
  • 00:45:40
    engaged when they had something to look
  • 00:45:42
    at so that way it kind of just dawned on
  • 00:45:44
    me that hey this is a useful thing not
  • 00:45:46
    only for me but for everyone else as
  • 00:45:51
    well great
  • 00:45:54
    thanks in fact I I can add to that um I
  • 00:45:56
    found you know what let me quickly dig
  • 00:45:58
    up that picture it's quite funny um I
  • 00:46:00
    found the original article um let's see
  • 00:46:04
    uh p n
  • 00:46:06
    there yeah I found this
  • 00:46:09
    picture this is from a a workshop at
  • 00:46:11
    Spotify that I did I was introducing
  • 00:46:13
    people to what product ownership is um
  • 00:46:16
    and I kept iterating on how to explain
  • 00:46:18
    that in a good way and I finally
  • 00:46:19
    stumbled over a way to visualize it
  • 00:46:21
    using a circle and the PO in the middle
  • 00:46:22
    and then stakeholders over here and
  • 00:46:23
    communication here and I started using
  • 00:46:25
    that and I noticed that people got a lot
  • 00:46:27
    a lot more engaged by that picture and
  • 00:46:29
    then someone in the workshop suggested
  • 00:46:30
    that hey you should share this picture
  • 00:46:33
    and I said but this picture is a mess no
  • 00:46:34
    one can understand it uh but then he
  • 00:46:36
    said why don't you make a video of you
  • 00:46:37
    drawing the picture I'm like oh that's a
  • 00:46:40
    good idea and that's exactly what I did
  • 00:46:42
    so that that's this so this picture
  • 00:46:44
    these pictures are the are the original
  • 00:46:45
    um chicken
  • 00:46:47
    Scrolls that that that that led to um to
  • 00:46:50
    this that's so cool feel like we've
  • 00:46:52
    being able to see behind the curtain a
  • 00:46:54
    little bit
  • 00:46:55
    there but yeah there are some more
  • 00:46:58
    questions yeah yeah I think um I see I
  • 00:47:02
    don't know if it's in the order in which
  • 00:47:03
    they were asked but um I see John next
  • 00:47:06
    and then Gan after John
  • 00:47:09
    yeah John you want to come for you y um
  • 00:47:12
    yeah I was asking what is your drawing
  • 00:47:15
    tool because I want to download it on my
  • 00:47:18
    laptop I had a hard time hearing what
  • 00:47:20
    you said the tool Henrik that you're
  • 00:47:22
    using um could you just uh share that
  • 00:47:25
    again what the app app that so I can
  • 00:47:27
    write it here so um for
  • 00:47:29
    recording um recording and editing
  • 00:47:34
    screen flow and I've tried using other
  • 00:47:36
    tools I keep getting back to screen flow
  • 00:47:38
    I think it's a really good tool and no
  • 00:47:40
    I'm not
  • 00:47:42
    sponsored and for for drawing it's art
  • 00:47:44
    rage and art rage is just a painting
  • 00:47:45
    program it's not it's not made for
  • 00:47:47
    making videos but I use screen flow to
  • 00:47:50
    record when I'm drawing an art raage and
  • 00:47:51
    that's pretty much
  • 00:47:55
    it great thank you oh and here's another
  • 00:47:58
    tip for you John because I only learned
  • 00:48:00
    this before the call when Henrik showed
  • 00:48:02
    me on Art rage it by default has the
  • 00:48:06
    cursor just as a yeah like a cross and I
  • 00:48:09
    was Googling it and I couldn't figure
  • 00:48:11
    out how he gets the pen on there and he
  • 00:48:13
    showed me and it's h is it the number
  • 00:48:14
    three Henrik you have to press there you
  • 00:48:17
    go press three one two three there magic
  • 00:48:21
    and it does add so much more like to it
  • 00:48:24
    when you see the pen rather than the
  • 00:48:25
    little and it changes now I'm using
  • 00:48:26
    brush
  • 00:48:28
    right so yeah I love it even when I
  • 00:48:31
    press the mouse look look at the tip of
  • 00:48:32
    the
  • 00:48:35
    brush do do you use layers or not in I
  • 00:48:38
    used only one layer I one layer for the
  • 00:48:40
    for the the figure and then one layer
  • 00:48:43
    for the background shading and that's it
  • 00:48:46
    ah got it super thank you thank you John
  • 00:48:51
    um Karen would you like to go next Karen
  • 00:48:53
    it's 1: a.m. for you right yeah yeah
  • 00:48:56
    it's going to be two
  • 00:48:59
    now it's a pleasure because I uh Ian the
  • 00:49:02
    interesting part when I came to Malaysia
  • 00:49:04
    my first engagement where the client was
  • 00:49:06
    saying do you know Spotify model and I
  • 00:49:08
    remember you always told uh in your most
  • 00:49:11
    of the time it's a culture of the
  • 00:49:12
    company not so it's it's a it's always
  • 00:49:14
    great uh listening to you en Rick and
  • 00:49:17
    today also it was very nice and we
  • 00:49:19
    picked up a lot of because I think a big
  • 00:49:22
    thing about visualization I think that's
  • 00:49:24
    something which really works out my
  • 00:49:26
    question is about about uh I mean I know
  • 00:49:28
    V agile coaches or we do trainings uh do
  • 00:49:32
    you since you talked about AI are you
  • 00:49:34
    using any AI tools or uh any any of the
  • 00:49:38
    recommendations for of course as you
  • 00:49:41
    said the agents and there will be
  • 00:49:43
    digital agents but is there any other
  • 00:49:45
    tools which you uh which you use to
  • 00:49:47
    enhance the experience during the
  • 00:49:49
    trainings or um not so much yet I use
  • 00:49:53
    the tools when creating materials I
  • 00:49:54
    sometimes use tools for simple things
  • 00:49:56
    like here I needed just images to
  • 00:49:57
    illustrate different technical
  • 00:49:58
    revolutions we've been through or I
  • 00:50:00
    wanted to illustrate you know uh uh just
  • 00:50:03
    show stuff so sometimes I use I use just
  • 00:50:05
    image generation sometimes but I also
  • 00:50:06
    still like to draw and am mods are not
  • 00:50:08
    good at drawing yet but probably in the
  • 00:50:11
    future I expect to be able to say things
  • 00:50:12
    like hey AI here's my drawing style and
  • 00:50:16
    I use like I like using metaphors for
  • 00:50:18
    like this so can you please make up a
  • 00:50:19
    suitable metaphor for XYZ using my
  • 00:50:21
    drawing style and it will give me some
  • 00:50:23
    examples and I'll get really
  • 00:50:24
    lazy um so that's probably what's going
  • 00:50:26
    to happen but I I also use it to iterate
  • 00:50:28
    on content to help me um figure out like
  • 00:50:31
    um what's the right level of of
  • 00:50:33
    explaining stuff uh but what I am
  • 00:50:36
    working on now is creating um various
  • 00:50:38
    forms of chat Bots to support my clients
  • 00:50:40
    so if they have some questions they can
  • 00:50:42
    ask my chatbot first and maybe I can
  • 00:50:43
    help them and if it can't then it'll
  • 00:50:45
    escalate to me and say hey you need to
  • 00:50:47
    talk about you need to talk to real
  • 00:50:48
    Henrik about this
  • 00:50:50
    one because many of the many of the uh
  • 00:50:53
    you know in the world of agile we heard
  • 00:50:55
    about gpts there many of the people who
  • 00:50:57
    are creating gpts yeah do you did that
  • 00:51:01
    did that thought struck to you or are
  • 00:51:02
    you also planning to create one of them
  • 00:51:05
    yeah I experimented a a little bit with
  • 00:51:07
    that um I I made one called a um let's
  • 00:51:11
    see called Fresh Start which I can I'm
  • 00:51:14
    going to pitch it right now I can
  • 00:51:15
    recommend it um it's uh excuse me let me
  • 00:51:18
    just log in here quickly um there we go
  • 00:51:23
    there fresh start I'll add a link to the
  • 00:51:26
    chat I guess um there we go uh this is
  • 00:51:30
    the little bot that's configured to be
  • 00:51:31
    uh in in my video here I talk about um
  • 00:51:34
    how I like to take a walk with AI and
  • 00:51:36
    and just tell it what's on my mind and
  • 00:51:39
    it will interview me and then finally
  • 00:51:41
    give me suggestions and then summarize
  • 00:51:42
    what I just said that's what fresh start
  • 00:51:44
    is do a brain dump it won't it won't
  • 00:51:46
    interrupt you it'll just say okay
  • 00:51:47
    whatever you say and only when you ask
  • 00:51:49
    for advice will they give you advice so
  • 00:51:52
    that's a very simple little GPT that I
  • 00:51:54
    that I made
  • 00:51:55
    but I like to experimenting with this
  • 00:51:58
    technology thank you so much thank you
  • 00:52:00
    very much appreciate
  • 00:52:02
    it and we are up to time but side I know
  • 00:52:06
    you've been waiting patiently so we'll
  • 00:52:08
    let you have the last
  • 00:52:10
    question yeah okay then then a
  • 00:52:13
    philosophical question I was just
  • 00:52:14
    wondering when um like I don't know a
  • 00:52:16
    year ago a year and a half ago when um
  • 00:52:19
    all this AI tools became a thing like
  • 00:52:23
    mid journey and dly you as a visual
  • 00:52:25
    thinker um where you scared out way your
  • 00:52:28
    thoughts when everybody all of a sudden
  • 00:52:30
    could create visuals with just a few
  • 00:52:33
    clicks or without even having the skill
  • 00:52:35
    to to draw something um I I I wasn't
  • 00:52:38
    scared I was inspired I I felt that this
  • 00:52:41
    gave me superpowers um if my job of
  • 00:52:44
    course my job is not making images
  • 00:52:46
    images is is a tool for me um if my job
  • 00:52:48
    was to create and sell images I would be
  • 00:52:50
    more worried but I would also think I
  • 00:52:53
    need to adopt this technology I need to
  • 00:52:54
    I need to embrace it and use it um
  • 00:52:56
    because hiding from it and and trying to
  • 00:52:58
    you know stop it or saying we shouldn't
  • 00:53:00
    do that I think is a dangerous
  • 00:53:02
    proposition it's better to as much as
  • 00:53:04
    possible just Embrace tools it's like
  • 00:53:05
    kind of if you're used to digging holes
  • 00:53:07
    with a shovel and suddenly an excavator
  • 00:53:09
    gets invented learn to drive the
  • 00:53:11
    excavator um that's kind of I think my
  • 00:53:15
    my my thinking around this so learn the
  • 00:53:16
    tools and let them give you
  • 00:53:22
    superpowers awesome um thank you so much
  • 00:53:26
    and apologies folks I know I I think I
  • 00:53:28
    accidentally advertised a session for 90
  • 00:53:30
    minutes but it should have been 60 so
  • 00:53:32
    yeah we we are over time and uh henrik's
  • 00:53:35
    had a really long day himself because he
  • 00:53:38
    literally had been commuting and uh
  • 00:53:40
    jumped straight on this call so I want
  • 00:53:42
    to I want to give him some rest as well
  • 00:53:44
    because I'm actually fine but maybe we
  • 00:53:46
    have a maybe yeah I'm I'm fine either
  • 00:53:49
    way so I think this is an interesting
  • 00:53:51
    topic
  • 00:53:52
    so shall we take one more then because
  • 00:53:55
    yeah yeah yeah oh thank you Leah's come
  • 00:53:57
    back in the queue come
  • 00:54:00
    Onish um Henrik you said that people are
  • 00:54:04
    drawn to the handdrawn
  • 00:54:06
    Doodles um which sort of suggests polish
  • 00:54:09
    stuff not necessarily but it sort of
  • 00:54:12
    suggest it's a bit dry on the dry side I
  • 00:54:15
    just wondered the um Doodles in that
  • 00:54:18
    first square with the smiley faces and
  • 00:54:21
    vehicles is that too polish you know how
  • 00:54:25
    polished what is a doodle and what is
  • 00:54:28
    Polish and what's gonna make people
  • 00:54:30
    switch off
  • 00:54:32
    so I think the fact that like when I
  • 00:54:34
    teach courses I tend to draw on a flip
  • 00:54:37
    chart nowadays instead of using slides
  • 00:54:38
    whenever possible and what I draw on the
  • 00:54:40
    flip chart is stuff that I already have
  • 00:54:42
    on a slide anyway but when I draw it
  • 00:54:44
    people get more engaged and because I'm
  • 00:54:45
    drawing live and I'm not an artist they
  • 00:54:47
    turn out really simple kind of like like
  • 00:54:49
    this um and the fact that that works and
  • 00:54:53
    the fact that this video is still the
  • 00:54:54
    most viral video I ever made
  • 00:54:56
    um indicates to me that everything else
  • 00:54:59
    I've made is overkill I think this is
  • 00:55:01
    overkill it doesn't need to be this
  • 00:55:02
    pretty this is definitely Overkill this
  • 00:55:05
    is overkill I think I could have just as
  • 00:55:07
    well created this video using this
  • 00:55:09
    simpler style and it would have been
  • 00:55:11
    absolutely
  • 00:55:13
    fine thank you thank you that's
  • 00:55:19
    helpful amazing um folks I've had a few
  • 00:55:22
    people ask where will the recording be
  • 00:55:24
    available so um for the regulars it's
  • 00:55:27
    going to be on the community platform
  • 00:55:29
    I've put the link in the chat uh so uh
  • 00:55:33
    if if you're not signed up to that then
  • 00:55:36
    please do and all of our recordings are
  • 00:55:38
    on there so they're freely available for
  • 00:55:40
    everybody to watch back so uh hopefully
  • 00:55:42
    um you you will check it out so uh there
  • 00:55:45
    you go but um Grant do you want to wrap
  • 00:55:48
    up because uh I I'd love to hand it back
  • 00:55:50
    to you to uh to say the last word oh
  • 00:55:53
    well just I mean just to say thanks so
  • 00:55:56
    much Henrik for uh for agreeing to join
  • 00:55:59
    us for giving us an Insight I've been
  • 00:56:00
    wondering for years how he did some of
  • 00:56:02
    those videos so I'm I feel like it just
  • 00:56:06
    been scratched you know I Now understand
  • 00:56:08
    was that surprising or was it kind of
  • 00:56:09
    what you expected I'm just curious like
  • 00:56:11
    what I think um I think I like you were
  • 00:56:14
    saying I I think I didn't appreciate how
  • 00:56:17
    much went into it because at first
  • 00:56:20
    glance it appears like you just casually
  • 00:56:23
    switched on your machine and started
  • 00:56:24
    drawing and talking um and so you've
  • 00:56:27
    shattered that illusion now
  • 00:56:30
    yeah but um but no it was fantastic
  • 00:56:33
    explanation and I think you know we've
  • 00:56:36
    had some really great comments in the
  • 00:56:38
    chat and also for this one Paddy we we
  • 00:56:41
    said we would actually put this video on
  • 00:56:43
    YouTube because of all the questions
  • 00:56:44
    that henrik's been getting about how he
  • 00:56:46
    makes his videos oh that's nice then I
  • 00:56:48
    can link to it that's great said we can
  • 00:56:49
    link to it so yeah we said we do that
  • 00:56:52
    but yeah just just to say thanks um
  • 00:56:54
    Henrik so much for joining us it's
  • 00:56:55
    really really great session thank you
  • 00:56:58
    this was great I love talking about this
  • 00:56:59
    kind of
  • 00:57:00
    stuff oh thank you so much folks should
  • 00:57:03
    we do some jazz hands for Henrik ja
  • 00:57:05
    hands
  • 00:57:07
    everybody and there is a LinkedIn post I
  • 00:57:09
    put in the chat as well if you want to
  • 00:57:11
    continue the conversation feel free to
  • 00:57:13
    to comment on there as well a AI does
  • 00:57:15
    not replace visual thinking I it
  • 00:57:18
    will there you go it's official it's
  • 00:57:20
    official yeah right I'll stop the
  • 00:57:22
    recording
Tags
  • Henrik Nyberg
  • Spotify
  • Lego
  • Generative AI
  • Digital Co-workers
  • Agile Practices
  • Visual Thinking
  • Video Creation
  • User Engagement
  • AI Agents