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Indonesia is heading to the polls this
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Wednesday in what's being called one of
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the biggest days in global democracy Now
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the polls will consist of two
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simultaneous elections one for the
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President and Vice President PE the
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other for members of parliament
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Governors regions and Mayors now more
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than 200 million people are eligible to
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vote and that makes Indonesia the
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world's third biggest democracy behind
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the US and India 5.7 million volunteers
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have been mobilized to oversee around
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820,000 polling stations all across the
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country and on the legislative front
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hundreds of thousands of candidates from
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18 political parties are competing for
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more than 20,000 positions the parties
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include Indonesian Democratic party of
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struggle or pdip led by former president
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megawati sukri party of functional
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groups or goka great Indonesia movement
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party or gindra led by defense minister
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and presidential candidate praa Santo
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National Democratic party or nasdem and
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National Awakening party or pkb led by
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vice presidential candidate miman isanda
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now Indonesians will have to choose more
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than
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2,700 provincial Parliament members more
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than
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17,500 Regency level Parliament members
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128 senators
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and 580 members of the House of
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Representatives on the presidential
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front locals will have to decide among
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these three candidates former Jakarta
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governor Anis baswedan who is running
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with muhim isanda defense minister praa
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subbiano with Gibran rakabuming raka as
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his running mate as well as former
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Central Governor ganja pranoo who is
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running with maut
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MD Now voters will be given either for
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or five ballot papers to pick the party
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or candidate of their choice they will
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be given a nail to poke a hole in the
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ballot paper before dipping their finger
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in ink as a precaution against a voter
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fraud they'll only have 6 hours to vote
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polled opening at 7:00 a.m. local time
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and closing at 1:00 in the afternoon
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unofficial results will trickle in hours
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after the close of voting but the
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official numbers will only come in by
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the 20th of March
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now the presidential candidates need a
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simple majority of votes to win if no
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one secures more than half of the votes
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and at least 20% of the votes in over
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half of Indonesia's provinces a runoff
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election will be held between the top
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two candidate pairs the campaigning
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period for the runoff race will begin at
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the start of June and the final vote
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will happen on the 26th of that month
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the winner of that round will take
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office in October newly elected National
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Representatives will be inaugurated on
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the 1 of that month while President Joko
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wodo and vice president Maru Amin will
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make way for the new ruling pair on the
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20th of
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October well of the three candidates
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vying to succeed president Joko wodo
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prao saano is said to be ahead of his
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younger rival ganja prano as well as
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Anis bedan they have there have been
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plenty of promises but also plenty of
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controversy in the campaigns for more on
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the elections let's go back to cna's
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looku speaking to us live from Jakarta
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she is joined by Dr yanu nroo a visiting
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senior fellow from the Indonesia studies
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program at IC YF vishak Institute as
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well as Arya Fernandez head researcher
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at the center for strategic and
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International
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Studies oh thanks for that jul and
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welcome welcome gentlemen to our studio
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in Jakarta now we just heard Jill there
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saying uh well uh president Joo Doo and
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his vice president will make way for the
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new ruling PIR on the 20th of October
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are things ever so simple in
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Indonesia I think uh we're facing right
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now the difficult situation when Mr P
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could not run for the election because
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of based on our con Constitution it's
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only serfer two term and now he endorsed
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Mr yeah Mr Wido cannot run for election
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because of Constitution and now he he
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endorsed Mr PR his minister of defense
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and pering with his sons Gibran RAB has
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he officially endorsed Mr PR to be fair
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absolutely to some extent we can we can
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see that he he endur Pro and you are
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laughing
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well because I think uh it's never uh
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official but I think everything lead
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leading to the advancement of Gibran to
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be the vice president candidates uh
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reveal uh what what happened I think
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okay gibron the eldest son of President
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Joko wi Doo and we very quickly not that
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quickly actually let's outline how this
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happened October 16th the Constitutional
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Court
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ruled made an exception for him to say
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that despite the fact that he did not
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hit 40 years of age he had run in a
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region office therefore he qualified to
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run for vice president Y and of course
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that in itself Mr Widodo said my
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children can choose anything they want
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I'm not getting in their way but what
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was worrying was everything else we've
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seen including other members of his
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family one of I think he he's trying to
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to build political Empire with endorsing
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his son as the Running Man of pros subo
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and then maybe to some extent um what
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kaang is the head of
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PSI party K is his second son is his
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second son and then his
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son-in-law Bobby mayor of let's take a
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look at the family tree of joku Doo both
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sons plus son-in-law now actively
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involved in politics two of them
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becoming Mayors in 2021 despite having
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relatively little experience in politics
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while jooo is still sitting president
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does that make a difference well I think
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uh that uh clearly uh to me
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uh if you want to if if you want to
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build political Dynasty and that's
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platan I think he is I don't know in
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another country if it happens but
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perhaps jooo is the only sitting
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president at the moment when uh his son
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and his son-in-law is the leader
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subnational government leaders I think I
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think he is he he advantages as the
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president
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with the greater Authority and um with
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the lot of resources politically and
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financially and then control um majority
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of the parliament seats he can control
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everything and he can for example he he
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can he can speak with the with the
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political party Elites and then try to
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negotiate with the his his future
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political agenda all right can I add
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something uh I think even if even if uh
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he is sort of allowed to use that
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resources sort of but then you mentioned
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the uh ruling of the uh constitutional
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Court which was ched by his own
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Uncle I think what so joo's brother
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brother-in-law basically's uncle gian's
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uncle so uh if I if I want to make my my
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my point clear Perhaps it is not about
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the law
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uh black on white but it is about
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ethical conduct and I can say that
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that's unethical not just ethics I think
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the the the the suggestion was that so
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kesan the Second Son in September on
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Saturday became member of a party by
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Monday he became chief of that party
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three weeks later you've got the
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Constitutional Court ruling allowing his
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elder brother to run for VP so I I I
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I'll ask both of you if you run through
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what's happened since say 2018 the
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changes in the laws the curbs of
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independent checking institutions the
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use of Institutions and the ag office to
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persuade let's put it this way
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coalitions to form in ways that benefit
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some parties more than others each one
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of you can you can you sum it up so that
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we get this picture individually each
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move is innocuous taken together they
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suggest something let's start with you I
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think this is the test for our democracy
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whether our democracy will getting
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better or RSE and I think uh Jo Jo Doo
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try to use his power to negotiate with
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with all party and we know that we don't
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have a good opposition party at the
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parliament because Mr President
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dominated with majority in the
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parliament we don't have like a uh
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parliamentary Watchdog who can control
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our executive and we we we think that
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after this election it maybe our parment
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should be higher more more control to
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the to the executive power and let's see
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what what the final result and I I
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believe that after this election our
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legislative power will be higher
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compared to the previous
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one if I put it this
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way uh in the second period of uh
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president joov VI Doo particularly I
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think what is absent is the is the
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contestation of
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ideas what merely happened was the uh
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fight for
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interest and this is reflected from the
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parties the Coalition of parties behind
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him to put it bluntly there is no check
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and balances because he controlled the
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parliament all parties become his
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supporter but you know arguably if I the
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president and I want things to go my way
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sure it is in my interest to control
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everything so you've got nine parties in
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Parliament seven are in his Coalition
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like 82% of the seats are his right so
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the two that are not the opposition
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nasam and PKS yes they don't make much
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of but it's not Mr widodo's fault that
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the opposition in Indonesia is so badly
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institutionalized and to evalate our
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political party system because we don't
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have no party don't have a lot of what
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uh huge money to run for uh for
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political mobilization we uh there is no
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uh State subsidy for political parties
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and political parties don't have a lot
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of money to run for their for the
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campaign for example for political
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education for political socialization so
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the party needs to join the cabinet to
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access for P bar program and Mr Udo uh
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effectively distributed all pork program
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to each his political party Coalition
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like for example gorar he he give he
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give gar with the what
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uh wanted to support an basen but
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somehow across the months it edged over
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to proos bio is that is that just rumor
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I think no from the beginning he Goa
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tried to prob uh I think what happened
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was uh you're right that that's not uh
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joov uh fault uh that that he he could
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of course that he could uh accumulate
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power right uh in the parliament to
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support him but I think what is missing
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here is that you can you can uh point
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fingers at the uh party or the political
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uh system in in Indonesia but what
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happened is that again the check and
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balance is is absent so if I put bluntly
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again the president can act as if it is
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a tyranny he can do anything
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without protest he can do anything there
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is no check and balance even from Civil
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Society who became I would say uh
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fragmented so there is no real uh check
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and balance in terms of power and I
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think this is what I would say as
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unhealthy is in the political system
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like in Indonesia I think I may be wrong
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but then who whose business is it to
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make sure that Democratic principles
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which actually is a fairly fuzzy notion
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but it probably does include an active
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opposition yes independent checking
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institutions such as the corruption
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anti-corruption commission such as the
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Constitutional Court these things should
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be checking the actions whose business
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is it in Indonesia to make sure that
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these things are up and
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running well uh the commission of for
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the eradication of corruption as you
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mentioned was weakened the the law was
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changed uh you know then the uh the
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dynasty politics uh leading up to the uh
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appointment of uh jooi uh young brother
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younger brother-in-law became the the uh
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the chairman I I think if you if you
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look at as a single or isolated uh
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incident that that that that should be
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like oh it looked okay it looks okay
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right but then when you put together uh
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as a picture then you will see that uh
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this all would lead to something that
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now I think what we see today when then
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people maybe they are late to realize
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this or maybe they already realized in
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the beginning but they didn't dare to
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say because at the time they were still
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believed in p
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jooi uh that he would do something
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something good but then now apparently
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with all the protest you you you see
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more than 200 univ today in my hometown
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in Georgia I'm from Georgia in my
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hometown more than 2,000 students uh
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gathered in the street protesting not
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against Papo but against Joo is why P
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jooi let this uh situation happen so I
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think again if we look uh at those uh
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incidents as an isolated uh event then
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what's wrong with this why I I cannot do
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this as as pres but then if you put all
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together then you will see what
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constitutes uh the problems of
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Indonesia's democracy today that's what
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I think all right uh final question to
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you and then Mr Arya now uh I I I I will
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play Devil's Advocate and and and
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support Mr Widodo on this one uh I'll
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say that he never apart from the
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standard comments that any leader makes
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about commitment to Human Rights
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commitment to democracy never pretended
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that he was a huge believer in the
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abstract notion of democracy but it's
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just that when we looked at him this
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very humble Furniture seller coming up
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really from The Roots he's the he's the
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poster child the beneficiary of
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reformasi okay so we expected him to
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then pay respect to reformasi and to
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Build It Up say well this gave me my
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chance I will now give everyone who
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wants to go through that route a chance
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but you don't think he did no I think we
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can have P Jovi as president exactly
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because we fought for democracy if we
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look back to what happened in
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1998 the reform the reform what happened
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at that time was that we like we
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self-corrected ourself you know uh from
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the president that can be uh in the
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position for basically uh forever and
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then we change we limit it into two
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periods M and we let this direct
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election to happen I would say that P
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Jovi is the born child of the Democracy
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that we fought in
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1998 of course as you said the there is
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no obligation from him right to to to
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uphold that principle but to me this is
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really really uh if I put the word
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betrayal to that uh reform because it is
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the Democracy that uh made possible
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someone like him who was no one of
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course he was a mayor from solo but the
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way he he went through his career uh
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Advan into governor and then uh elected
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as president but now what he is doing I
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think with advancing Gibran advancing uh
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uh kaang in this I
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think I don't know how how to put it in
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word uh except the if I use the word
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betrayal to the Democracy do you do you
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agree betrayal yes no very quickly yeah
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I think this is like the test for our
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democracy and maybe our democracy Now is
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under Trade under the trade and uh again
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we have to yeah this
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election will will be tomorrow and we
00:18:04
have to make sure that this is peaceful
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election with the to ensure the
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political stability and that need for
00:18:10
for yeah the day after tomorrow yeah
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okay oh thanks so much for that uh Dr
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Yano nuro uh visiting senior fellow of
00:18:21
Indonesian studies program Isis use of
00:18:23
ishak Institute and you as well do Mr
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ayya Fernandez head Department of
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politics and social change organization
00:18:30
from csis thanks so much for coming this
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evening thank you
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