The Woman Who Helps NBA Stars To Sleep: Stop Having Showers Just Before Bed! Dr Cheri Mah
Summary
TLDRDr. Sharim Ma, a well-known sleep specialist, reveals the profound effects of sleep on both professional and athletic performance. She highlights the benefits of a good night’s sleep, including improved cognitive function, enhanced sports performance, and emotional regulation. Dr. Ma's research, involving NBA, NFL, and other professional athletes, demonstrates that even slight sleep improvements can boost reaction times, accuracy in performance metrics like free throws, and sprint speeds by significant percentages. A key takeaway is that sleep should be proactive and prioritized, not just a recovery activity. Dr. Ma emphasizes small adjustments in sleep habits, like adjusting sleep environments to be dark and quiet, eating thoughtfully before sleep, and understanding personal sleep needs rather than adhering to a rigid sleep schedule. Additionally, the concept of “sleep debt” is important, indicating that inadequate sleep accumulates a deficit that takes extended periods or systematic recovery to overcome. Strategies for better sleep include a consistent bedtime routine, short naps with caffeine for an alertness boost, and personalized sleep training. Dr. Ma also advocates for scheduled sleep quality not only to enhance personal health but also professional capacities, warning that decisions made while sleep-deprived often result in poor outcomes.
Takeaways
- 💤 Quality sleep is crucial for optimal performance.
- 🛏️ Create a dark, quiet bedroom environment.
- ⏳ Small increases in sleep lead to big performance boosts.
- 🏃♂️ Sleep impacts reaction time and sports performance.
- 🧠 A well-rested brain improves decision-making.
- 📝 Personalize sleep schedules to individual needs.
- 🥣 Even pre-sleep snacks can affect sleep quality.
- ⚖️ Manage sleep debt for long-term benefits.
- 😴 Power naps can enhance alertness and performance.
- 🚫 Avoid alcohol and heavy meals before bed.
- ⏲️ Timing of bedtime routines like showers affects sleep.
- 🤯 Tiredness affects emotional regulation and responses.
Timeline
- 00:00:00 - 00:05:00
Dr. Shari Ma is an expert in sleep optimization with significant contributions in various professional sports leagues and organizations. Dr. Ma discusses the importance of sleep for elite athletes, citing improvements in reaction time, free throw accuracy, and sprinting speed with better sleep. Practical strategies, including adjusting shower timing and understanding pre-sleep meals, are recommended to optimize sleep.
- 00:05:00 - 00:10:00
Sleep physician Dr. Ma highlights her work with NBA, NFL, and MLB teams, improving performance through sleep scheduling and travel management. CEOs also benefit from sleep optimization by improving decision-making abilities. Misconceptions about sleep needs vary, with some overestimating the glory of minimal sleep, while recognizing variability in individual sleep needs can facilitate better performance.
- 00:10:00 - 00:15:00
Dr. Ma dispels sleep myths, emphasizing personalized sleep requirements. A mere 15 minutes more sleep can enhance performance, demonstrated in high school studies correlating sleep with academic performance. Encouraging athletes to extend sleep demonstrated significant improvements in basketball performance metrics, reinforcing the value of adequate rest.
- 00:15:00 - 00:20:00
Research reveals the pronounced impact of extended sleep on athletes' performance, with marked improvements in shooting accuracy and reaction times. Dr. Ma discusses the understanding that small shifts in sleep duration lead to significant performance gains, akin to a competitive advantage in sports. The conversation highlights how strategic sleep extension aids in fatigue management and injury prevention.
- 00:20:00 - 00:25:00
Studies on performance before and after sleep extension show improvements in various metrics in male basketball players, including shooting and quickness. Dr. Ma's findings underscore the critical role of sleep in athletes' performance peaks, noting that systematic sleep habits contribute more to outcomes than marginal talent improvements.
- 00:25:00 - 00:30:00
Research emphasizes the strategic advantage of sleep management in sports, noting significant performance improvements through extended sleep. Discussions on adapting sleep schedules reveal the influence of sleep quantity on athletes' success, corroborated by studies on reaction time, alertness, and results of 'nappuccino' caffeine-nap combinations for professional advantages.
- 00:30:00 - 00:35:00
Dr. Ma addresses misconceptions about sleep, advocating tailored sleep solutions over a universal approach. She highlights how extended sleep positively alters cognitive and physical capabilities, with further explanation of practical exercises and sleep hygiene improvements to optimize athletes' restfulness and performance.
- 00:35:00 - 00:40:00
Strategic sleep practices, like scheduling power naps closely before game time or setting a conducive sleep environment, have notably enhanced athlete like Andre Iguodala's performance and extended careers. Dr. Ma details nutritional and habit modifications made to improve rest quality, showing transformational impacts on NBA players.
- 00:40:00 - 00:45:00
Dr. Ma explains how minor sleep adjustments yield profound benefits, illustrated by her experience optimizing schedules and environments for athletes like Andre Iguodala, which fueled career longevity. Sleep extensions paralleled by meal timing adjustments were shown to significantly improve his game statistics and overall performance.
- 00:45:00 - 00:50:00
The discussion involves sleep's effect on injury prevention and athlete career longevity. Dr. Ma highlights how improved sleep hygiene, including strategic power naps and environmental adjustments, have facilitated athletes' performance and response times. Sleep science application in predicting game outcomes based on travel schedules shows robust success rates.
- 00:50:00 - 00:55:00
Elite athletes demonstrate performance spikes with consistent sleep, disproving notions like the snooze button's utility for fragmented sleep recovery. Data highlights optimized sleep routine applications, invoking awareness of the correlation between consolidated rest and cognitive functions for athletes.
- 00:55:00 - 01:00:00
Dr. Ma shares insights on how cognitive functions, reaction times and decision-making are improved substantially with better sleep, impacting both sports and executive success stories. Performance on and off the field benefits from strategic sleep investments, demonstrated by historical cases of optimized sleep routines for athletes and leaders.
- 01:00:00 - 01:05:00
The intricacies of sleep deprivation's impact on behavior, emotional responses, and decision-making are addressed by Dr. Ma. Studies link sleep deficiencies to decision-making calamities and emotional volatility, emphasizing the importance of structured sleep-guiding tools to enhance cognitive functions.
- 01:05:00 - 01:10:00
Scientific explorations reinforce that improving sleep benefits executives similarly to athletes by enhancing cognitive reaction and decision speed, although recovery from sleep debt must be gradual. Dr. Ma underscores these study findings, advising proactive sleep management for peak cognition.
- 01:10:00 - 01:15:00
Dr. Ma emphasizes sleep's foundational role in cognitive enhancements and well-being, noting gradual repairs of accumulated sleep debt are necessary for improved reaction times and decision-making capabilities. Evidence from athletic performance studies reinforces strategic sleep increases lead to long-term gains.
- 01:15:00 - 01:20:00
Dr. Ma discounts the feasibility of banking sleep, urging consistent sleep quality to ameliorate cognitive performance and mitigate losses in reaction time and judgment proficiency. Her research denotes the measurable improvement in cognitive functions with regular, adequate sleep extension.
- 01:20:00 - 01:25:00
For optimized travel adaptation, Dr. Ma recommends proactive sleep scheduling, hydration, and nutrition adjustments based on circadian rhythms. Her findings advocate for conscious planning and adjustments pre, during, and post travel to align sleep-wake cycles with new time zones for minimized jetlag impact.
- 01:25:00 - 01:30:00
Practical sleep tips for frequent travelers address pre-flight strategies like avoiding last-minute packing, during-flight hydration, and optimized sleep environments. Leveraging technology, strategic naps, and adjusting light exposure aid in reducing travel fatigue.
- 01:30:00 - 01:36:20
Dr. Ma concludes the profound influence of sleep improvement on personal and professional life, showcasing transformations in athletes’ careers through sleep optimization. Sleep’s role as a pivotal, proactive health measure is stressed, supporting peak performance and improved quality of life.
Mind Map
Video Q&A
Who is Dr. Sharim Ma?
Dr. Sharim Ma is a renowned sleep doctor and performance expert who has worked with athletes and high-performing professionals to optimize sleep.
What are some strategies for better sleep?
Some strategies include dark and quiet sleep environments, avoiding alcohol and heavy meals before bed, and practicing a consistent night routine.
How does sleep affect athletic performance?
Sufficient sleep can improve reaction times, accuracy in free throws, and sprint speeds, making a significant difference in athletic performance.
What is the impact of sleep debt?
Sleep debt occurs when you don't get your needed amount of sleep, affecting cognitive functions and performance, which cannot be recovered with one or two nights of good sleep.
What are nap benefits?
Short naps, especially with caffeine (nappuccino), can boost alertness and performance without affecting nighttime sleep.
What is a nappuccino?
A nappuccino involves consuming caffeine before a short nap, maximizing alertness as both the caffeine and nap effects kick in.
How does sleep affect decision-making and emotions?
Lack of sleep impairs decision-making, cognitive function, and emotional regulation, leading to more reactive and emotional responses.
Does sex impact sleep positively or negatively?
While not extensively covered, sex is implied to potentially improve sleep quality and relaxation before sleep.
Can professional training be improved with better sleep?
Yes, proper sleep training is shown to improve consistency and reduce variability in performance, leading to fewer injuries.
What are common misconceptions about sleep?
Misconceptions include the idea that everyone needs the same amount of sleep and that more sleep isn't necessary for high performance.
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- 00:00:00I was 86% correct on accurately
- 00:00:02predicting when an NBA team will be at
- 00:00:04highest risk of losing strictly based on
- 00:00:06the sleep oh gosh yes and just 15 or 30
- 00:00:10minutes can make a difference so let's
- 00:00:12dive into just some very practical
- 00:00:14strategies to get the best sleep
- 00:00:16possible Dr sharim ma is a renowned
- 00:00:18sleep doctor and performance expert
- 00:00:20whose sleep optimization research has
- 00:00:22enhanced the careers of CEOs as well as
- 00:00:24athletes in the NFL MLB and Formula 1
- 00:00:27and has provided lifechanging expertise
- 00:00:29to companies like under aror and Google
- 00:00:31for my Elite athletes that I work with
- 00:00:34sufficient sleep it's a game Cher for
- 00:00:36example we saw 12% faster Reaction Time
- 00:00:39a 9% Improvement in free throws and a 4%
- 00:00:42increase in Faster Sprint time and when
- 00:00:45you experience what it feels like to be
- 00:00:47well rested you never want to go back
- 00:00:49getting insufficient sleep and it
- 00:00:50doesn't have to be these big jumps I'd
- 00:00:52love to dig into that okay so i' have a
- 00:00:54shower then I get straight into bed
- 00:00:55after is that good or bad tweak the
- 00:00:57timing of your shower and your hot bath
- 00:00:59to just an hour or two before bed it's
- 00:01:02hard to grasp how much of a difference
- 00:01:04this can make in your life what about
- 00:01:06sex does it have an impact on your sleep
- 00:01:09okay so is there anything that I can eat
- 00:01:11before bed that won't disrupt my sleep
- 00:01:12but will get rid of The Hunger there's a
- 00:01:14pre-sleep meal for example cereal and
- 00:01:16milk cereal and the reason why is
- 00:01:18because and then I read this fascinating
- 00:01:21word nappuccino yes this is a useful
- 00:01:23tool if you're a working professional
- 00:01:25and you need a little boost and
- 00:01:26alertness and performance what you do is
- 00:01:31the DI of AO raffle is about to close
- 00:01:35anyone that subscribes to the DI ofo
- 00:01:36before we hit 7 million subscribers
- 00:01:39which is probably going to be in a
- 00:01:40couple of days time you will be included
- 00:01:42in the raffle and on the day we hit 7
- 00:01:44million subscribers we are giving away a
- 00:01:46lot of money can't buy prizes to all of
- 00:01:49you so hit the Subscribe button get in
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- 00:01:55below when we hit 7 million subscribers
- 00:01:58[Music]
- 00:02:01Dr M what is it you do and why is it so
- 00:02:07important in your mind that you do
- 00:02:09it great question so I am a sleep
- 00:02:12physician um but I spend a lot of my
- 00:02:15time and career trying to educate and
- 00:02:18and advocate for people to prioritize
- 00:02:21sleep right this fascinating process
- 00:02:23that each of us does every single night
- 00:02:25and arguably is about a third of our
- 00:02:27lives but many individuals don't do this
- 00:02:30very well or they you know sacrifice it
- 00:02:32and overlook this area I very much
- 00:02:35believe if you don't sleep your best you
- 00:02:38will not be your best or counter to that
- 00:02:41is if you your if your sleep is best
- 00:02:44you'll be at your best and what that
- 00:02:46means if I unpack that a little bit more
- 00:02:48is we often are sacrificing our sleep
- 00:02:50we're underslept we often don't have
- 00:02:52good quality sleep it we're very
- 00:02:55reactive to our sleep at night time and
- 00:02:57it's the last thing that we think of at
- 00:02:58the end of the day when we wrap
- 00:03:00everything up um and that's arguably not
- 00:03:02going to put ourselves up to be the best
- 00:03:05we can be in the following day right and
- 00:03:08for my Elite athletes that I work with
- 00:03:10when you actually get sufficient sleep
- 00:03:13you have practices that you plan into
- 00:03:16your day and you actually are more
- 00:03:18proactive with that it can be a game
- 00:03:21Cher and for them when it comes to
- 00:03:23performance on the field that can be the
- 00:03:25difference of a 9% Improvement in free
- 00:03:28throw shots it can mean reacting 12%
- 00:03:31faster and so until you experience that
- 00:03:35it sometimes is hard to grasp how much
- 00:03:37of a difference this can make in your
- 00:03:39life but it is one of the foundations
- 00:03:42that will impact everything about how
- 00:03:43you function your mood how you feel and
- 00:03:46ultimately perform the following day if
- 00:03:49I could offer you or yes you
- 00:03:51specifically see if I could offer you
- 00:03:53something that's free and healthy and
- 00:03:56safe that's going to help you think more
- 00:03:59clearly make better decisions be in a
- 00:04:02better mood be more productive and
- 00:04:04efficient would you want it of course
- 00:04:07how much exactly and so it's really a
- 00:04:10decision of whether you want to invest
- 00:04:13uh your time to be able to be more
- 00:04:14proactive with this particular area of
- 00:04:17your life to get the benefits that come
- 00:04:19down the road with it who do you work
- 00:04:21with give me a sort of broad spectrum of
- 00:04:24the individuals organizations that
- 00:04:26you've worked with on sleep and why have
- 00:04:29they come to you I've had an opportunity
- 00:04:32to work with a number of professional
- 00:04:34sports teams and athletes as well as
- 00:04:36organizations over the years to try and
- 00:04:38apply the science into practice to help
- 00:04:41them improve their sleep their
- 00:04:42scheduling and their travel so for
- 00:04:44example I've been with the San Francisco
- 00:04:46Giants in Major League Baseball I've
- 00:04:49worked with um NBA teams like the Golden
- 00:04:51State Warriors uh NFL teams like the
- 00:04:54Philadelphia Eagles I won a Super Bowl
- 00:04:56ring in 2017 with them to um other
- 00:05:00sports organizations like Nike and under
- 00:05:03arour and ESPN to try and show how you
- 00:05:06can predict when NBA teams will lose
- 00:05:08strictly based on the schedule and
- 00:05:11insufficient sleep opportunities um to
- 00:05:13individual athletes who recognize you
- 00:05:15know hey this is an area that I am not
- 00:05:19optimizing and I know this can be such a
- 00:05:22valuable asset to extend my career to
- 00:05:24prevent injuries down the road and to
- 00:05:26help me be at my best do you ever work
- 00:05:28with CEOs I do I do work with Executives
- 00:05:32and seite um um Executives to try and
- 00:05:35help them be their best because they too
- 00:05:37are high performers right their
- 00:05:39performance outcomes are maybe a little
- 00:05:41bit different than pro athletes where
- 00:05:43we're quantifying on field performance
- 00:05:45and looking at their swim times and what
- 00:05:48they're doing when it comes to the you
- 00:05:50know onc court or on field um
- 00:05:53performance outcomes but for these
- 00:05:54Executives they arguably are also making
- 00:05:56incredibly important decisions they have
- 00:05:58to still react when they're under
- 00:06:00pressure and they have to make good
- 00:06:01judgment calls and so many of the things
- 00:06:04that I coach and and try to recommend to
- 00:06:07my lead athletes are very much
- 00:06:09applicable to the SE Suite executive or
- 00:06:12even just the working professional
- 00:06:14that's really what what I found so
- 00:06:15fascinating about your research and your
- 00:06:16work is that although there's a focus on
- 00:06:19athletes as someone who is also
- 00:06:21traveling is also very very busy also um
- 00:06:25struggles with sleep sometimes because
- 00:06:26I'm I have to perform late at night
- 00:06:28whether that's on stage or with meetings
- 00:06:29or whatever it might be I resonated with
- 00:06:32so much of it and I also train in the
- 00:06:35gym pretty much every day if I can um
- 00:06:38and I've also noticed a correlation
- 00:06:40between things like injury in the gym
- 00:06:43based on how I'm sleeping in my quote
- 00:06:45unquote sleep de but I but I I want to
- 00:06:48confront two things the first thing I
- 00:06:49want to confront is the misconceptions
- 00:06:50around sleep that you encounter over and
- 00:06:52over again what are the like big
- 00:06:54overarching misconceptions that stand in
- 00:06:56the way of people believing in and
- 00:06:59implementing the advice that you give
- 00:07:02them I'll start with just this badge of
- 00:07:05honor that I really believe still
- 00:07:06persists in society where you should get
- 00:07:08only four or five hours of sleep and
- 00:07:10should be able to perform at your best
- 00:07:12and I think the tides are turning and I
- 00:07:14do think that that is changing over the
- 00:07:16last several years where there are more
- 00:07:19vocal Advocates of um you know Elite
- 00:07:23athletes like the Tom Brady who you know
- 00:07:26say everything is around performance
- 00:07:27enhancement I going need to go to to bed
- 00:07:29early so that I can wake up early and to
- 00:07:32be ready to go for the day to you know
- 00:07:34the Simone bios who says I need to get 8
- 00:07:36hours of sleep and so I think that that
- 00:07:39is a badge of honor that is now shifting
- 00:07:41and now it's going to become well if
- 00:07:43you're not getting your 8 n 10 hours of
- 00:07:46sleep right then you're actually at a
- 00:07:48decrement to yourself and you're
- 00:07:50actually not going to set yourself up to
- 00:07:52be the best that you could possibly be
- 00:07:54whether you're on the field as a pro
- 00:07:55athlete or whether you're leading an
- 00:07:57organization or trying to go after
- 00:07:59whatever ever it is that matters to you
- 00:08:01right and and I think that's going to
- 00:08:03continue to shift but I'm excited about
- 00:08:05it because that's one thing until you
- 00:08:07experience that that difference and that
- 00:08:10life transformation of what it feels
- 00:08:12like to be well rested then it can be a
- 00:08:15game changer you never want to go back
- 00:08:16to it again when you're getting
- 00:08:18insufficient sleep are there any
- 00:08:20misconceptions around how to sleep in
- 00:08:22sleep hygiene and um I know the
- 00:08:25quantities of sleep weeny that also seem
- 00:08:28to stand in people's way
- 00:08:29of them getting a great night's sleep
- 00:08:32yeah so I think that there is a
- 00:08:33misconception that everyone needs a
- 00:08:35certain amount of sleep there's
- 00:08:36individual variability so the the
- 00:08:39recommendation from the American Academy
- 00:08:41of sleep medicine and the Sleep research
- 00:08:43Society so two of our national
- 00:08:44organizations here in the US recommend
- 00:08:46minimally 7 hours of sleep but that's
- 00:08:48the lower threshold you might actually
- 00:08:50need 8 hours or 9 hours or more to feel
- 00:08:53well rested right I I personally feel
- 00:08:55terrible on seven hours and I much more
- 00:08:57need the eight to nine hours and there's
- 00:09:00those in that individual differences so
- 00:09:02you need to find what you feel well
- 00:09:04rested you're able to function well at a
- 00:09:07high level during the day and that will
- 00:09:10then be your individual requirement so I
- 00:09:12think there's this misperception that
- 00:09:14everyone needs a certain amount but you
- 00:09:16need to find what works for you and it's
- 00:09:17all about small changes so if you're not
- 00:09:20at 7 hours I think you shared sometimes
- 00:09:22you're you're you're under that oh yeah
- 00:09:23sometimes yeah you know it's about F 15
- 00:09:27or 30 minutes more can make a difference
- 00:09:29refence so if you're getting 6 hours
- 00:09:31then I'm going to recommend getting 15
- 00:09:33minutes or 30 minutes more every day for
- 00:09:36this one week and then get 15 or 30
- 00:09:38minutes more next week so that you're
- 00:09:40building from say 6 hours of sleep to 6
- 00:09:42and a half hours and you may not think
- 00:09:44that that's that much but we can all do
- 00:09:4615 minutes more right we're less
- 00:09:47scrolling or doing what we're wrapping
- 00:09:50up our day but those 15 minutes add up
- 00:09:52where that's a difference of like an a
- 00:09:54student to a b student or 11 minutes
- 00:09:56more sleep is the difference of a b
- 00:09:58student to a c student in one of these
- 00:10:00studies really exactly and then over the
- 00:10:03course of a week 15 minutes will be
- 00:10:05almost 2 hours more sleep than if you
- 00:10:08didn't what was the study so this was a
- 00:10:10study done um in high school students
- 00:10:13but looking at the difference of how
- 00:10:14much they're sleeping versus their
- 00:10:17correlation to to grades and so that
- 00:10:1915minute difference was shown to be that
- 00:10:22A to B student 11 minutes from that B to
- 00:10:24C student oh gosh yes so it doesn't have
- 00:10:28to be these big jumps
- 00:10:29but small changes over time will will
- 00:10:32add up the the study I have in front of
- 00:10:34me here which I've printed out um also
- 00:10:37highlights the importance of sleep for
- 00:10:39everybody but also specifically in this
- 00:10:41case for athletes can you walk me
- 00:10:44through this study and what you found in
- 00:10:46this particular study on the adult male
- 00:10:48basketball players yes and how you
- 00:10:50conducted the study so in the study we
- 00:10:53looked at the men's basketball team and
- 00:10:55we really tried to examine if we
- 00:10:57extended their sleep over 5 to 7 weeks
- 00:11:00encouraging them to get 9 or 10 hours of
- 00:11:03sleep every single night to B pay back
- 00:11:06what we call an accumulated sleep debt
- 00:11:08would we see any impact on performance
- 00:11:11outcome specifically would we see an
- 00:11:13impact on reaction time their fatigue
- 00:11:15levels and would we see an impact on
- 00:11:18their onc Court performance specifically
- 00:11:20free throw shots three-point shots
- 00:11:22Sprint time and these are measures that
- 00:11:25we would do after every regular practice
- 00:11:28and over the course of those 5 to 7
- 00:11:30weeks we demonstrated that we saw a 9%
- 00:11:32Improvement in free throws a 9%
- 00:11:35Improvement in three-point shots we saw
- 00:11:37a 12% faster reaction time and a 4%
- 00:11:41increase in uh faster Sprint time and so
- 00:11:45these were the quantification which was
- 00:11:48novel at the time was what was quite
- 00:11:49fascinating because it wasn't that 1%
- 00:11:52that I think many Elite athletes are
- 00:11:54trying to find every small way to adjust
- 00:11:57their training to get that 1% better
- 00:11:59better because in Elite Sport that 1%
- 00:12:01can be the difference right of being at
- 00:12:03the top versus not but this was arguably
- 00:12:069% or even double digits for Reaction
- 00:12:09Time depending on the outcome and so
- 00:12:11we've expanded that looking at other
- 00:12:13sports as well but this was one of the
- 00:12:14first ones to show that it really
- 00:12:17potentially could have a significant
- 00:12:18impact on performance outcome for these
- 00:12:20athletes how much did they sleep more
- 00:12:22per night to get those results yeah so
- 00:12:25they did so we did quantify objectively
- 00:12:27through a uh what's called actigraphy it
- 00:12:30looks like a wearable nowadays um and
- 00:12:33then compar that also with what they
- 00:12:34thought they were getting and so we did
- 00:12:36extend their sleep um uh substantially
- 00:12:39over I believe an hour and a half uh
- 00:12:42compared to what they were getting prior
- 00:12:44to the study because getting 9% more
- 00:12:47free throws or three-point shots or 12%
- 00:12:51better reaction time is quite frankly
- 00:12:53for some teams the difference between
- 00:12:55like winning a championship and not yeah
- 00:12:57because I think about the Premier League
- 00:12:58often which is it's soccer I guess
- 00:13:01football um often time there's been
- 00:13:04leagues within my lifetime there's been
- 00:13:05years in my lifetime where both teams
- 00:13:07have um tied with the same amount of
- 00:13:09points and one is one just on the amount
- 00:13:10of goals they've scored they've just
- 00:13:12scored a couple more goals so after 38
- 00:13:14games they both have the exact same
- 00:13:16points and the winner is just the person
- 00:13:17that scored like a couple more goals but
- 00:13:20even you think of reaction times you
- 00:13:21think of goalkeepers in in soccer their
- 00:13:23whole game is reaction time so if you
- 00:13:25can increase your reaction time by 12%
- 00:13:27it's really really staggering
- 00:13:30it can be a game changer and I think
- 00:13:31that's what has been so fascinating with
- 00:13:33some of the athletes or organizations
- 00:13:35and teams I've worked with who have made
- 00:13:37it to the most important games and those
- 00:13:40championships because the hope is that
- 00:13:43you've invested not just the night
- 00:13:46before that championship game but you've
- 00:13:47invested an entire season even starting
- 00:13:50in the off season on cultivating better
- 00:13:52habits to give yourself that foundation
- 00:13:55and be able to leverage these strategies
- 00:13:57that the other team is not because we
- 00:14:00know that it significantly can impact
- 00:14:02not just the individual level on
- 00:14:04performance outcome but organizations as
- 00:14:06a whole and I think one example of that
- 00:14:08is um I partnered with ESPN to do what
- 00:14:11was called the NBA schedule alert
- 00:14:13project where they ask can you predict
- 00:14:15Dr ma when NBA teams are going to be at
- 00:14:18risk of losing games strictly based on
- 00:14:20the schedule so not factoring in
- 00:14:23strength of team but based simply on
- 00:14:26their schedule where they're traveling
- 00:14:28to how many times are crossing these
- 00:14:30various factors does it affect
- 00:14:32organizations as a whole and teams and
- 00:14:35their game outcomes as you mentioned and
- 00:14:37over three seasons I was 76 to 86%
- 00:14:40correct on accurately predicting when an
- 00:14:43NBA team will be at highest risk of
- 00:14:45losing strictly based on the schedule so
- 00:14:47in the spirit of the project we didn't
- 00:14:49factor in strength of team but to me
- 00:14:51that was staggering because there's many
- 00:14:54other factors that maybe are not always
- 00:14:56considered to be as clearly important
- 00:15:00about you know this travel schedule up
- 00:15:02front but hey maybe these factors really
- 00:15:04do play and influence um game outcomes
- 00:15:07in this way and that's not the only
- 00:15:08thing that has obviously shown that
- 00:15:11organizations and teams as a as a whole
- 00:15:13will have differences performance
- 00:15:15outcome there's other studies like the
- 00:15:17Monday Night Football study that showed
- 00:15:19if you simply bet on a West Coast team
- 00:15:23when they play an East Coast West Coast
- 00:15:25matchup during night games over 25
- 00:15:28seasons you'd beat the Las Vegas point
- 00:15:30spread 68% of the time and so if you're
- 00:15:33able to predict with with greater
- 00:15:35accuracy then obviously there is
- 00:15:37potentially some gambling outcomes that
- 00:15:39could work in your favor here but really
- 00:15:41being able to show that you would be
- 00:15:43able to benefit and predict better than
- 00:15:46what the spread will be between the the
- 00:15:48two teams over is that because the West
- 00:15:51sorry the West Coast team has gone which
- 00:15:54who's who's traveled it doesn't matter
- 00:15:56it simply matters that the West Coast
- 00:15:58team is playing the east Coast team
- 00:15:59during night games so this can happen on
- 00:16:01the west coast it can happen on the East
- 00:16:03Coast the reason why is because
- 00:16:04performance is enhanced in the late
- 00:16:06afternoon to evening around 4: to 8:00
- 00:16:09in both scenarios the body clock of the
- 00:16:12West Coast team because they typically
- 00:16:15go out just the day before the game it
- 00:16:18feels like they're on the west coast
- 00:16:20okay right so when you're a West Coast
- 00:16:23team and you stay there and the East
- 00:16:25Coast team comes out the East Coast is
- 00:16:27three hours later so what is a seven
- 00:16:29o'clock game on a West Coast feels like
- 00:16:32a 10 o'clock game for a East Coast team
- 00:16:34got you same thing applies when the West
- 00:16:37Coast team goes east coast even if it's
- 00:16:39a 7:00 game there yeah the West Coast
- 00:16:42feels like it's a 4:00 body clock yes
- 00:16:45and so that special window of around 4:
- 00:16:48to 8:00 p.m. when world records are
- 00:16:49broken and performance in a 24-hour day
- 00:16:53is is optimal and that is leveraged then
- 00:16:56over those 25 Seasons that the West
- 00:16:59Coast will have more favorable outcome
- 00:17:01overall got you so in this study you did
- 00:17:03in 2011 that was published in 2011 one
- 00:17:06of the things I read as well is that
- 00:17:07players who had slept more in your study
- 00:17:11sprinted
- 00:17:13faster I mean quite quite dramatically
- 00:17:15faster as well I I think from 16.2
- 00:17:18seconds at the start of the study versus
- 00:17:2115.5 seconds at the end yes over what
- 00:17:23distance was that yes so that was from
- 00:17:25the Baseline to half court to Baseline
- 00:17:27to full court and back so we chose a
- 00:17:29very standardized
- 00:17:31sprinting uh sprinting drill that they
- 00:17:34are familiar with that we could
- 00:17:36replicate after every regular practice
- 00:17:37as you imagine not everyone on the team
- 00:17:39was participating on in this study and
- 00:17:41so they did this after every regular
- 00:17:43practice and that ended up being a 4%
- 00:17:46difference in Sprint time that is pretty
- 00:17:48crazy do do do professional teams know
- 00:17:51this do athletes know this are they
- 00:17:53aware of this or is this something
- 00:17:54that's fairly new some are aware and I
- 00:17:57think the momentum is shifting towards
- 00:18:00more athletes more teams recognizing
- 00:18:02that this is an untapped competitive
- 00:18:05advantage that this is an area that they
- 00:18:08may or may not have implemented specific
- 00:18:11strategies or education or or planning
- 00:18:14for when they travel but I think the
- 00:18:16more Forward Thinking organizations
- 00:18:19teams and athletes are starting to pick
- 00:18:22this up and starting to recognize that
- 00:18:24they can use this as a weapon right as a
- 00:18:27performance-enhancing drug if you may
- 00:18:29because it is safe it's healthy it's
- 00:18:31effective and we know that it will be
- 00:18:34one of the only things that can give you
- 00:18:36these performance benefits um and and
- 00:18:39those are the ones that are trying to
- 00:18:41Leverage The Science into application
- 00:18:43for optimizing yeah their sleep at
- 00:18:45nighttime have you seen athletes
- 00:18:47individual athletes change and save
- 00:18:50their careers when I say change I mean
- 00:18:52change the trajectory of their career or
- 00:18:54save their careers because they focused
- 00:18:57on their sleep and can you give me some
- 00:18:58examples of that yes Golden State
- 00:19:01Warriors Andre Iguodala he's someone who
- 00:19:03I worked closely with he came to the
- 00:19:05Warriors back in around 2014 he was
- 00:19:09already an Allstar he was 28 at the time
- 00:19:12knew that his career was going to
- 00:19:15probably be sunsetting at some future
- 00:19:17time but wanted to extend it as long as
- 00:19:18possible but he knew he wasn't doing
- 00:19:20sleep best as possible he was very open
- 00:19:24about sharing how he would stay up till
- 00:19:26the we hours in the morning playing
- 00:19:27video games would sleep for a few hours
- 00:19:30go to practice play for a few hours come
- 00:19:32home and take a 2 to three hour power
- 00:19:33nap and that was his routine for for 10
- 00:19:36years um and he said you know how do I
- 00:19:39improve how I approach my sleep I know
- 00:19:41that this is important as an athlete to
- 00:19:44who wants to play in the league as long
- 00:19:45as possible so I had the opportunity to
- 00:19:47work with him over several months to
- 00:19:49help him recraft how he approached to
- 00:19:51sleep including a wind down routine
- 00:19:54thought about some of his nutritional
- 00:19:55choices tried to shorten his naps time
- 00:19:58them closer to game time to give him the
- 00:20:00Boost and alertness and performance be
- 00:20:03able to manage a racing mind and be able
- 00:20:05to have just a more proactive approach
- 00:20:07to his sleep in a really neat way The
- 00:20:10Following Season the Warriors went to
- 00:20:12the championship for the first time in
- 00:20:15many years they won he came back with
- 00:20:17the finals MVP he subsequently has won
- 00:20:21three more championships with them so
- 00:20:23four in total and extended his career
- 00:20:25for 10 years when we made these changes
- 00:20:28there was a quantification of the
- 00:20:30performance enhancement so a third party
- 00:20:32Quantified as he went from under seven
- 00:20:34to seven and a half to more than eight
- 00:20:36hours he had a two-fold increase in his
- 00:20:39threo percentage he had a
- 00:20:4288.9% increase in his free throw shots
- 00:20:46which very interestingly is the exact
- 00:20:48same 9% that I showed in my man's
- 00:20:50basketball study that had the same 9%
- 00:20:54Improvement in free throws he had a 29%
- 00:20:58Improvement in his points per minute a
- 00:21:0045% decrease in his fowls and so you
- 00:21:04know these numbers are pretty staggering
- 00:21:06again for someone who's already at the
- 00:21:08highest level as an Allstar and it's not
- 00:21:10to take anything away from Andre but he
- 00:21:12has been very vocal about the difference
- 00:21:14this made as he changed these habits it
- 00:21:16he says it changed everything for him
- 00:21:19and I think that that's you know a very
- 00:21:21inspiring story of what it can mean to
- 00:21:25extend your career and be able to almost
- 00:21:27tap into this additional performance
- 00:21:29capacity that I think even he was
- 00:21:31surprised about that he for the first
- 00:21:34time was able to improve beyond what he
- 00:21:38already thought was his best and I think
- 00:21:40that's what's so inspiring because this
- 00:21:42is something that's accessible to all of
- 00:21:43us to be able to tap into that little
- 00:21:45bit more so not only did he win the most
- 00:21:46valuable player award but his
- 00:21:48three-point conversion went up
- 00:21:53218% yes so during the time that I had
- 00:21:55worked with him his three-o percentage
- 00:21:57went up twofold during that time it begs
- 00:22:00the question what did you do to
- 00:22:03him and you know you named a couple of
- 00:22:05things there but I'd love to dig into
- 00:22:06some of those key points sure um where
- 00:22:09you started with him the specific sort
- 00:22:11of implement things that you implemented
- 00:22:13into his um sleep hygiene and so that if
- 00:22:17I am him the day that you met him when
- 00:22:20he was taking those naps and staying up
- 00:22:21late which I often do to be fair um
- 00:22:24where would you start with me and where
- 00:22:25did you start with him okay so let's
- 00:22:28dive into is just some very practical
- 00:22:30strategies that I started to challenge
- 00:22:31him with which was we'll start with his
- 00:22:34sleep environment we want to make your
- 00:22:36sleep environment like a cave really
- 00:22:39dark quiet cool and
- 00:22:42comfortable dark cave so dark blackout
- 00:22:46curtains eye mask are some of the
- 00:22:48easiest tools that you can grab but are
- 00:22:50incredibly helpful and great investment
- 00:22:52to be able to use that both at home and
- 00:22:54then when you travel so that if you're
- 00:22:56in a non-ideal environment like a hotel
- 00:22:58room you have for example an IM mask
- 00:23:00that can help dampen out the the light
- 00:23:03uh making it quiet so
- 00:23:05earplugs uh also a white noise machine
- 00:23:07I'm a huge fan of even a small travel
- 00:23:09white noise so that you can actually
- 00:23:11mask over external noises that you may
- 00:23:13or not be able to control I'm someone
- 00:23:15that tells myself that I sleep with
- 00:23:17something playing for I grew up with a
- 00:23:19radio in my room so when I'm as an adult
- 00:23:21now I'm always looking to play something
- 00:23:23as I fall asleep is that going to hurt
- 00:23:25my Sleep Quality I would say if you're
- 00:23:27accustomed to this would say that's fine
- 00:23:29to continue to do so I am not a fan of
- 00:23:31having the TV on and having the bright
- 00:23:33light exposed um to you in that hour
- 00:23:36before bedtime because it also can just
- 00:23:38be very psychologically stimulating but
- 00:23:40if like you said it's a radio or it's a
- 00:23:42podcast that you feel is helping you
- 00:23:44relax then I'm a fan of it do you think
- 00:23:46Daria will help people relax it
- 00:23:49might it might help you at least think
- 00:23:51about your sleep a bit more and
- 00:23:53challenge you to do maybe one one change
- 00:23:55tonight we consider that to be a
- 00:23:57scientific endorsement of of the podcast
- 00:23:59um okay so I've got sound down you are a
- 00:24:03fan of the white white noise machines I
- 00:24:05am because sometimes there's external
- 00:24:06noises like a garbage truck or
- 00:24:09construction that you're not always able
- 00:24:11to control so if you can at least mask
- 00:24:12over it temporarily that can sometimes
- 00:24:15be helpful to keep individuals more
- 00:24:17asleep during the night time and there's
- 00:24:19even some now that are adaptive so if
- 00:24:21the door slams then the volume
- 00:24:23temporarily increases and then will
- 00:24:25decrease so there's almost these smart
- 00:24:27white noise machine that are that are
- 00:24:29coming out on the market so that's from
- 00:24:31a noise standpoint and earplugs are
- 00:24:33going to be helpful if you're traveling
- 00:24:35when you're at home you can obviously
- 00:24:36use those to dampen down any external
- 00:24:38noise from a from a temperature
- 00:24:40standpoint you want it to be cool I
- 00:24:42think this is an area that a lot of
- 00:24:43people can benefit from because they
- 00:24:45often sleep in much warmer temperatures
- 00:24:47than what we know is probably more
- 00:24:49conducive to sleep which is cooler 60 to
- 00:24:5267° has been shown to help individuals
- 00:24:55stay asleep and fall asleep that may be
- 00:24:58frigidly cold for some but you have to
- 00:25:00find the temperature that's right for
- 00:25:02you I would say decrease your
- 00:25:04temperature by say one degree or two
- 00:25:06degrees every couple of days and then
- 00:25:07you can find the temperature that works
- 00:25:09well for you and there's even technology
- 00:25:11now where there's mattress covers that
- 00:25:13can help you regulate temperature from
- 00:25:17much cooler to warmer so if there's
- 00:25:19differences in bed Partners that's a way
- 00:25:21that you can actually accommodate both
- 00:25:22of their preferences so that's about 16
- 00:25:25to 20° cus
- 00:25:28what about when I shower or I bath
- 00:25:31because often I go and have a shower
- 00:25:33then I get straight into bed after yes
- 00:25:35is that good or bad I would encourage
- 00:25:38you to shift that timing a little bit
- 00:25:40earlier into the night so an hour and a
- 00:25:42half before you are planning to go to
- 00:25:44bed I would shift your shower because
- 00:25:48when you are taking a hot bath or hot
- 00:25:50shower it increases your core
- 00:25:52temperature but when you fall asleep
- 00:25:54your core temperature drops so you don't
- 00:25:56want that competing signal to be right
- 00:26:00before bedtime but if you back that
- 00:26:02shower up an hour and a half that should
- 00:26:05be sufficient time that we think
- 00:26:06potentially there's an augmentation of
- 00:26:08helping that drop in temperature and
- 00:26:11some smaller Studies have shown that
- 00:26:12that can help decrease the time to fall
- 00:26:14asleep and also enhance deep sleep which
- 00:26:17has implications for Muscle Recovery
- 00:26:20regeneration and you get more of that in
- 00:26:22the earlier part of your night so it's
- 00:26:24an easy fix uh just to tweak the timing
- 00:26:27of your shower in your hot bath to be
- 00:26:29just an hour or two before bedtime not
- 00:26:32right before bed so it's a strategy too
- 00:26:33if you have difficulties winding down
- 00:26:36and relaxing to implement that hot
- 00:26:38shower hot bath earlier in the evening
- 00:26:41one of the problems I also have when I
- 00:26:42sleep sometimes is I I hear people say
- 00:26:45you got to you can't eat like 3 or 4
- 00:26:47hours before bed however I sometimes you
- 00:26:51know I sometimes get home at 10:00 p.m.
- 00:26:53and I get home hungry as hell at 10 p.m.
- 00:26:56and then sometimes if I order food for
- 00:26:58for example it might come at like 11:00
- 00:26:59okay which means I end up eating at
- 00:27:0111:00 and then I really see it in my
- 00:27:03sleep schools
- 00:27:05um I think as well that I'm someone that
- 00:27:08tends to fall asleep later again this
- 00:27:10might just be me telling BS to myself
- 00:27:12but that's what tends to happen and I
- 00:27:13know I'm not supposed to eat before bed
- 00:27:15but I'm so hungry so is there anything
- 00:27:18that I can eat before bed that won't
- 00:27:19disrupt my sleep but will get rid of The
- 00:27:21Hunger yes the preference is not to have
- 00:27:23a huge meal right before bed that's
- 00:27:26fried fatty um you know really heavy
- 00:27:29sitting in your stomach that hour right
- 00:27:32before bedtime um so if you're able to
- 00:27:34time that and be strategic then that's
- 00:27:35obviously the preference but I'm okay
- 00:27:37with you having a pre-sleep snack a lot
- 00:27:39of times for my athletes that means
- 00:27:41we'll go for something like 50% of a
- 00:27:43complex carb and like 50% of a lean
- 00:27:46protein so for example cereal and milk
- 00:27:48is an easy one cereal yes cereal and
- 00:27:51milk of course we want something that's
- 00:27:53whole grain uh and not you know
- 00:27:55necessarily A sugary you know cereal but
- 00:27:58Cal and milk is an easy one that's many
- 00:28:01people have access to or cottage cheese
- 00:28:03and fruit or 100% ho whe crackers and
- 00:28:06peanut butter and the reason why is
- 00:28:08because I don't want you waking up in
- 00:28:10the middle of the night being hungry or
- 00:28:11even trying to fall asleep and you feel
- 00:28:13like you're hungry but we want something
- 00:28:14that's slow digesting through the night
- 00:28:16because ideally you're going to be
- 00:28:17sleeping S 8 n hours during the night uh
- 00:28:21and we want it to be able to get you to
- 00:28:23the morning time and then you will fuel
- 00:28:25when you wake up so a pre-sleep snack
- 00:28:27can can be a great strategy if you're
- 00:28:29coming home late and you want to
- 00:28:31obviously be able to fuel before bed or
- 00:28:33if you have a really early dinner and
- 00:28:35you're hungry before bedtime yeah that
- 00:28:37happens sometimes as well sometimes I'll
- 00:28:38eat dinner at about 5:00 p.m. Y and then
- 00:28:41I get to about 10 11:00 p.m. I'm still
- 00:28:43awake and I'm starving okay so what's a
- 00:28:45pre-sleep snack that you think you can
- 00:28:46grab for some nuts okay yeah does that
- 00:28:49work yeah yeah nuts have protein in them
- 00:28:52um yeah you can grab a good nut mix
- 00:28:55maybe you can partner that also with
- 00:28:56like some yogurt too raspberries
- 00:28:59raspberries yeah fruit yeah and some
- 00:29:02yeah a a protein and carbon there and
- 00:29:05those are good good pre-sleep snack
- 00:29:08what's the if I wanted to destroy my
- 00:29:10sleep what would you recommend I eat
- 00:29:12right before bed what would you
- 00:29:14recommend I I yeah consume right before
- 00:29:16bed it can be if you just want to
- 00:29:17destroy your entirely okay so we're
- 00:29:20going to have the the night cap of
- 00:29:23having a couple of drinks right before
- 00:29:25bed okay so some alcohol yeah we'll have
- 00:29:27some alcohol on board we'll we'll throw
- 00:29:29in some caffeine too to to really get
- 00:29:32you to stay awake in the next couple of
- 00:29:35hours we add a really heavy meal that's
- 00:29:38Fried Tomato based um fatty sitting in
- 00:29:42your stomach right before bed and you
- 00:29:44say tomato based yeah sometimes
- 00:29:46individuals will have acid reflux with
- 00:29:49tomato based products and so if that's
- 00:29:51something that is is yeah is that
- 00:29:53something that you experience then you
- 00:29:55generally want to avoid some of the
- 00:29:57Tomato based products that can aggravate
- 00:29:58some of the acid reflux so some fried
- 00:30:02food with some
- 00:30:04ketchup yes okay so alcohol caffeine and
- 00:30:07some fried food with some ketchup I
- 00:30:09think that would really work to your
- 00:30:12disadvantage during the nighttime any
- 00:30:14sugar yes sugary carbs are tends to be
- 00:30:18some of the preferences when you're
- 00:30:20particularly also sleep deprived so
- 00:30:21people will choose more carb heavy foods
- 00:30:25and foods that have um less fiber and
- 00:30:28more more sugar why fats is it that if I
- 00:30:32eat those Foods before bed it impacts my
- 00:30:34sleep what what what's going on I don't
- 00:30:37think we have a great understanding of
- 00:30:39that I think the field of sleep and
- 00:30:40nutrition is definitely growing and I
- 00:30:43think down the road in the next five or
- 00:30:4410 years we hopefully we'll have more
- 00:30:46answers to that but it's a fast area
- 00:30:48that we do start to understand what we
- 00:30:50eat can affect our sleep so for example
- 00:30:52the stages of our sleep or how we sleep
- 00:30:55during the night time some of the
- 00:30:57smaller studies shown what you eat can
- 00:30:59then affect having more Awakenings
- 00:31:01during the nighttime um and affecting
- 00:31:03the quality of your sleep but I think
- 00:31:05many of them are still at the infancy
- 00:31:08because that's certainly something I can
- 00:31:09attest to I I talked about one time many
- 00:31:11months ago I think it was last year
- 00:31:13actually when I I was staying in a hotel
- 00:31:14here in LA and I had a cookie before bed
- 00:31:17because it was cuz I'm bloody you know I
- 00:31:19blame the hotel I don't really blame the
- 00:31:20hotel I take full responsibility it was
- 00:31:22in the mini bar and I hadn't eaten all
- 00:31:24day I'd came back I'd been working all
- 00:31:26day and when I'm when when I'm when I've
- 00:31:28been working a lot I'm much more likely
- 00:31:30to reach for something bad and I had
- 00:31:32this cookie and honestly I woke up the
- 00:31:33next morning 8 hours later feeling like
- 00:31:35I hadn't slept at all I just felt so
- 00:31:39tired and I know it was that Bloody
- 00:31:41cookie cuz I looked at my um my whoop
- 00:31:44hashad investor and I could see that my
- 00:31:47heart rate throughout the night was
- 00:31:48really high like atypically high my
- 00:31:50heart rate throughout the night will
- 00:31:51usually just be this nice flat I don't
- 00:31:53know 50 55 beats per minute and when I'd
- 00:31:56had that cookie it it started and pretty
- 00:31:58much stayed for the first 3 or 4 hours
- 00:32:00about 75 beats so it was like my body
- 00:32:03was was still on it was like I was
- 00:32:06walking MH um and so I've always just
- 00:32:09had this idea that when I if you eat
- 00:32:10something like that right before bed
- 00:32:12like puts your body under a lot of
- 00:32:14strain like metabolic strain then it's
- 00:32:16kind of like your body doesn't fall
- 00:32:19asleep and my REM sleep's always
- 00:32:21attacked as well if I if I if I were to
- 00:32:23eat something like that yeah it's it's
- 00:32:25very fascinating I think we're starting
- 00:32:27to understand the connection of what we
- 00:32:30eat how our gut is responding to that
- 00:32:32and then how that potentially can affect
- 00:32:34your sleep and then ultimately your
- 00:32:36daytime functioning the next day but we
- 00:32:38do recognize from sleep deprivation
- 00:32:40studies uh that individuals will make
- 00:32:42different nutritional choices and grab
- 00:32:44for the cookies and the ice cream and
- 00:32:46some of those other snacks later at
- 00:32:48night than they would if they were well
- 00:32:51rested that's a real horrible Paradox
- 00:32:53isn't it it is do you know what I mean
- 00:32:56like if you're tired then you're going
- 00:32:57to eat bad things right before bed which
- 00:32:59is going to make you sleep worse and
- 00:33:01make you tired which is going to mean
- 00:33:03you eat bad things before bed is vicious
- 00:33:05cycle it is and unfortunately that could
- 00:33:07potentially lead to potential weight
- 00:33:09gain and other Downstream consequences
- 00:33:12so just one other reason why obviously
- 00:33:15making sure you're having sufficient
- 00:33:16sleep but also having good practices and
- 00:33:19your approach to sleep is also um a
- 00:33:22priority so you're asking what else did
- 00:33:24we do with Andre but in that ways of
- 00:33:28preparing to sleep you know we addressed
- 00:33:30does he have a windown routine so we
- 00:33:32implemented one where he would read
- 00:33:35before bed to actually relax and prepare
- 00:33:38his brain and body to sleep for the
- 00:33:39night managing a racing mind can be
- 00:33:42incredibly common for not just the elate
- 00:33:44athlete but for for all of us and so
- 00:33:47even before he did that reading we'd
- 00:33:49actually have him stretch and process
- 00:33:51his thoughts outside of bed and that set
- 00:33:54him up with a two-part system so that he
- 00:33:57could actually be strategic about
- 00:33:59preparing to sleep for the night a lot
- 00:34:02of people can relate to this managing a
- 00:34:03racing mind athletes um performers
- 00:34:07creatives um so if I've got a racing
- 00:34:11mind I think as well I think I tend to
- 00:34:13feel like I have my best ideas just
- 00:34:15before I'm about to get in bed what
- 00:34:17would you recommend someone do if they
- 00:34:18have a racing mind again incredibly
- 00:34:21common to have racing thoughts thinking
- 00:34:24through the day needing to process your
- 00:34:26thoughts about how to prepare for
- 00:34:28tomorrow so what I'd recommend is
- 00:34:30spending 10 minutes processing your
- 00:34:33thoughts outside of bed in dim light
- 00:34:36every single night so that can mean I
- 00:34:39would recommend you could do stretching
- 00:34:42H you could do deep breathing exercises
- 00:34:44to activate your parasympathetic system
- 00:34:46and dampen down your sympathetic system
- 00:34:48that's what I recommend for a lot of my
- 00:34:50athletes if that's not your thing I
- 00:34:52recommend journaling getting your
- 00:34:54thoughts down onto paper uh or writing a
- 00:34:57to-do list
- 00:34:58those are easy ones that all of us can
- 00:35:00do for even if you start with 5 minutes
- 00:35:02today so I'm going to stretch um I've
- 00:35:05read I read something I think it was
- 00:35:06whoops data they released at the end of
- 00:35:08the year where they because there's an
- 00:35:10activity log in whoop where you
- 00:35:11basically say what you're doing and I'm
- 00:35:13going to butcher this but I think the
- 00:35:15stats said that reading before bed
- 00:35:18improved your sleep by about 5% across
- 00:35:21everyone that was using ROP which makes
- 00:35:23sense because you're going to be away
- 00:35:25from Light I guess and you're also going
- 00:35:28to be calming your you called it your
- 00:35:30parasympathetic nervous system yes the
- 00:35:32parasympathetic nervous system what do I
- 00:35:33need to know about that in the context
- 00:35:35of sleep that's just the system that
- 00:35:37helps you relax and wind down the it is
- 00:35:41in balance with the sympathetic system
- 00:35:43which you may have heard is the fight or
- 00:35:44flight system that gets you going that's
- 00:35:46where your heartbe heartbeat will be
- 00:35:48much more rapid your breathing can be
- 00:35:50much more rapid when you need to go
- 00:35:52that's when I'm overthinking yes but you
- 00:35:54want to dampen that down and you want to
- 00:35:56get your parasympathetic atic system
- 00:35:58activated so you can help actually relax
- 00:36:00physiologically your body and also your
- 00:36:02brain so that you're in a better state
- 00:36:05to sleep at night right it's easier to
- 00:36:09slowly pump your brakes and then try to
- 00:36:12sleep versus if you were going 60 M an
- 00:36:14hour on a freeway and then suddenly
- 00:36:15slamming on the brakes and just jumping
- 00:36:17into bed so you actually have a process
- 00:36:20to slow yourself down your brain and
- 00:36:22body it will help prepare you to
- 00:36:24actually get better sleep during the
- 00:36:26night time just want to close off on
- 00:36:28Andrew then is there anything else you
- 00:36:29did with him to yes there's please give
- 00:36:31me there's more that we've done with
- 00:36:33Andre but this is to give you some
- 00:36:34highlights so you know approaches to his
- 00:36:37sleep were having that way to process
- 00:36:40his thoughts being able to wind down
- 00:36:42before bed and relax improving his sleep
- 00:36:46environment so that it was as I
- 00:36:48mentioned dark and cool I believe his
- 00:36:51was around 67 degrees it was quiet um we
- 00:36:54tried to we took out technology from his
- 00:36:57bedroom so he didn't have that exposure
- 00:36:59prior to bed we looked at cutting down
- 00:37:03some of his power naps that were several
- 00:37:05hours long to shorten them to 20 to 30
- 00:37:07minutes and time it much closer to game
- 00:37:09time so we would get that boost as you
- 00:37:11would go into evening
- 00:37:13games um and we looked at some of his
- 00:37:16nutritional choices but this is the
- 00:37:18highlight of of some of the ways that we
- 00:37:20were strategic about his approach to
- 00:37:22sleep and while we're also extending his
- 00:37:24sleep from that under 7 to 7 and 1 12 to
- 00:37:278 hours because we knew he had an
- 00:37:29accumulated sleep debt that had been
- 00:37:31built from not getting sufficient sleep
- 00:37:33probably for many months to years prior
- 00:37:35to this and so as we've shared some of
- 00:37:39the performance outcomes were
- 00:37:40astonishing and he's been very vocal
- 00:37:42about sharing his sleep story and he's
- 00:37:44not the only one um if I could share
- 00:37:46another story about another athlete
- 00:37:48where you've asked what has saved
- 00:37:50someone's career so with Andre I think
- 00:37:52he saw this performance enhancement that
- 00:37:55he could tap into that was that was um
- 00:37:58previously he didn't know almost existed
- 00:38:01right but then there's other athletes
- 00:38:02where I think having sleep as a
- 00:38:05foundation almost save their career one
- 00:38:08example is Ryan Jensen so Ryan Jensen
- 00:38:10was cut from the Ravens and put on the
- 00:38:12practice squad and during this time as
- 00:38:15the story goes his father said you know
- 00:38:18what's happening you're not yourself you
- 00:38:19like made your mom cry the other day you
- 00:38:22know there there's something that's
- 00:38:23going on and he eventually was tested
- 00:38:27for sleep apnea which is a very very
- 00:38:30common sleep disorder where your Airway
- 00:38:33has some partial or full collapse during
- 00:38:35the air during the night and so can have
- 00:38:36very fragmented sleep through the night
- 00:38:40and he was eventually tested diagnosed
- 00:38:43and then put on treatment through what's
- 00:38:46called a CPAP or continuous positive
- 00:38:48airway pressure so it's a it's a mask
- 00:38:50that provides air to keep the airway
- 00:38:53open so then you actually can have
- 00:38:55Consolidated sleep during the nighttime
- 00:38:58and in a very neat way four years later
- 00:39:02Ryan Jensen comes back signs a $42
- 00:39:05million contract as one of the highest
- 00:39:08paid centers in the NFL and then 3 years
- 00:39:11later in
- 00:39:122021 wins the Super Bowl with Tom Brady
- 00:39:16on the Bucks I see this as the success
- 00:39:18story of Saving his career and he's been
- 00:39:20vocal about how much of a difference it
- 00:39:23made from literally almost the end of
- 00:39:25his career happening to now being able
- 00:39:27to succeed at the highest level and also
- 00:39:29of course being healthier and being able
- 00:39:32to have um more success on the field
- 00:39:34than he probably imagined for himself
- 00:39:37and better relationships presumably he's
- 00:39:39not made his mother cry I'm quite
- 00:39:40curious about that why is it that when
- 00:39:42we haven't slept we're more likely to
- 00:39:44make people cry because we are our
- 00:39:47emotions are not regulated well when
- 00:39:50we're short on sleep we are more
- 00:39:52irritable we are more grouchy we respond
- 00:39:56more with our emo
- 00:39:58being able to um why we respond with our
- 00:40:01emotions yeah what's going on in the
- 00:40:02body is it like a different part of my
- 00:40:03brain is it my hormones is it something
- 00:40:05else it's probably a combination of both
- 00:40:08right we know that um our emotional
- 00:40:10regulation is not the same if we're well
- 00:40:12rested versus if we're asleep deprived
- 00:40:15and so we rely more on our innate
- 00:40:17response which may not necessarily be
- 00:40:19that which is strategic for what we
- 00:40:22should be responding with if we were
- 00:40:24tempered and had a better rest under our
- 00:40:26belt um so we ask cognitively there's a
- 00:40:29an implication of which part of your
- 00:40:31brain you're going to be using but then
- 00:40:33also you are just not in a state in
- 00:40:36which you are going to be able to
- 00:40:38respond in the way that you would
- 00:40:40otherwise is it the amydala that's the
- 00:40:42emotional center that is one that's
- 00:40:44where like fear is very much um and
- 00:40:47emotions and and um yeah the amydala is
- 00:40:50where like fear and emotions are are
- 00:40:52often centered because I've started when
- 00:40:53I started learning more about sleep and
- 00:40:55the impact it has on my emotions I could
- 00:40:56see a huge VAR in how
- 00:41:00um how I make my decisions but also how
- 00:41:03like short I can be yeah if I haven't
- 00:41:06slept yeah and so on the days now where
- 00:41:09I haven't slept I literally have a
- 00:41:10conversation with myself and tell myself
- 00:41:12that I'm going to be in my M mdala today
- 00:41:14so to try not to make any decisions try
- 00:41:16not to talk to many people because
- 00:41:18there's a risk that I might just be I
- 00:41:20might be too short in how I consider
- 00:41:22things and how I respond and I really
- 00:41:24want to stay away from that but I've
- 00:41:26seen such a huge huge variant and I've
- 00:41:27also heard of other like famous CEOs and
- 00:41:29stuff like that talk about how they they
- 00:41:33focus so much on their sleep I can't was
- 00:41:35reading something the other day and it
- 00:41:36was I think it was it was Jeff Bezos do
- 00:41:40you know what I'm gonna say I don't but
- 00:41:42Jeff Bezos is someone who has been an
- 00:41:44advocate about sleep and vocal that he
- 00:41:46needs eight hours every night yes the
- 00:41:48quote that I heard him say or someone
- 00:41:51told me that he said was I think it
- 00:41:53might have been Ariana Huffington
- 00:41:54actually he said that his job as a CEO
- 00:41:59is to make decisions and he says he
- 00:42:01doesn't have to make that many decisions
- 00:42:02a year he only makes a couple of big
- 00:42:04decisions a year every day he's probably
- 00:42:06just making two or three big decisions
- 00:42:08so if his job is to make decisions then
- 00:42:11his job is also to sleep because the
- 00:42:14variance I see in even my own decision-
- 00:42:16making when I'm slept and underslept is
- 00:42:17just unbelievably staggering as someone
- 00:42:20that sits here for seven eight hours a
- 00:42:22day sometimes having
- 00:42:23conversations you wouldn't believe the
- 00:42:25difference when my brain and my mouth
- 00:42:27are like connected because I've slept
- 00:42:29it's like a different human being it's a
- 00:42:31different podcast host um have you got
- 00:42:33data to support this this impact on
- 00:42:35cognitive performance yes so you
- 00:42:38definitely make better decisions when
- 00:42:39you're well rested you're less likely to
- 00:42:42make cognitive errors you have better
- 00:42:45judgment when you're well rested and
- 00:42:47you're going to react faster so in the
- 00:42:49situations where you need to make big
- 00:42:52decisions whether it's on the field and
- 00:42:54you need to react because you're running
- 00:42:56a pass whe whether you are Jeff Bezos
- 00:42:58and you're running a company and you
- 00:43:00need to make critical decisions um under
- 00:43:03under sometimes you know acute stressors
- 00:43:06or you are someone who just is trying to
- 00:43:09be your best we know that the cognitive
- 00:43:12domain very much is influenced by
- 00:43:14getting sufficient sleep and some of the
- 00:43:16I would say you know large um very very
- 00:43:21public disasters have happened as a
- 00:43:24result of what we know is sleep loss um
- 00:43:27where people have made poor decisions or
- 00:43:30decisions that have led to unfortunate
- 00:43:32disaster so for example the Challenger
- 00:43:34disaster with a space shuttle that
- 00:43:37exploded um and as a result there's
- 00:43:39investigations of why did this happen
- 00:43:42and the final report does suggest that
- 00:43:44insufficient sleep for some of those key
- 00:43:47decision makers around being able to
- 00:43:49launch or not was attributed to fatigue
- 00:43:52and insufficient sleep so being able to
- 00:43:53make good Dame time decisions had this
- 00:43:56disastrous effect ultimately on the
- 00:43:58Challenger explosion or are you aware of
- 00:44:01any studies that have measured cognitive
- 00:44:04performance on and sleep yes so my
- 00:44:08studies as well as many of my other
- 00:44:10colleagues particularly look at reaction
- 00:44:12time because we know reaction time is um
- 00:44:15very finely or is very sensitive to
- 00:44:17sleep loss and I'm starting to find it
- 00:44:19also is sensitive to extension of sleep
- 00:44:22so the other half of the story when you
- 00:44:24pay back sleep sleep debt we see that
- 00:44:27benefit on on uh reaction time but uh
- 00:44:31reaction time and looking at aspects of
- 00:44:34you know how quickly you're able to
- 00:44:36respond or if you're having errors when
- 00:44:38you're responding and you're not
- 00:44:39supposed to be responding cognitively
- 00:44:42those are um tests that are typically
- 00:44:44used in a lot of sleep studies because
- 00:44:45we know is quite sensitive can you give
- 00:44:47me an example of a study that will
- 00:44:49convince me that um if I sleep more my
- 00:44:52cognitive performance will improve one
- 00:44:55of the studies I mentioned before even
- 00:44:5615 15 minutes more sleep was that
- 00:44:58difference of that a student to the B
- 00:45:00student there's another study I often
- 00:45:02cite where if you look at the difference
- 00:45:04of someone who gets 9 hours of sleep for
- 00:45:06a full week the reaction time stays very
- 00:45:09consistent great you want to react
- 00:45:11appropriately you want to not make
- 00:45:13cognitive errors or lapses in judgment
- 00:45:15and that will be consistent over the
- 00:45:16week if you're someone who's getting
- 00:45:18seven hours of sleep you see a slowing
- 00:45:20of that reaction time and then a
- 00:45:22leveling off if you are getting 5 hours
- 00:45:24of sleep you see an even sharper decline
- 00:45:27in being able to react fast and then you
- 00:45:30see a leveling off if you're getting
- 00:45:31three hours of sleep every night you're
- 00:45:33just going to tank that reaction time
- 00:45:35and be slower at the same time you have
- 00:45:37more lapses in judgment and not able to
- 00:45:40respond appropriately but the the thing
- 00:45:43about this study that I find so
- 00:45:44fascinating is when we know that there's
- 00:45:47this deficit when you're going to react
- 00:45:50slower in the seven and the 5our group
- 00:45:53there's this leveling off so people say
- 00:45:54oh can I get used to getting
- 00:45:56insufficiency sleep in some sense there
- 00:45:58was this stabilizing of it but the
- 00:46:00reality is you're not at your best right
- 00:46:02we know what your reaction time could be
- 00:46:04if you were getting that 9 hours and if
- 00:46:06we even gave you three nights of what we
- 00:46:08call recovery sleep so we said okay now
- 00:46:11we get let's say 8 hours in bed for the
- 00:46:13next 3 days you're going to feel better
- 00:46:15and you'll probably feel more refreshed
- 00:46:17but those reaction times for the 7 hours
- 00:46:20and the 5 hours and the 3H hour group
- 00:46:23didn't go back to the Baseline so it
- 00:46:25takes more than one night night or one
- 00:46:27weekend of that recovery sleep to get
- 00:46:31you back to your Baseline and so that's
- 00:46:33the bottom line that I tried to show my
- 00:46:35athletes is that you can pay back sleep
- 00:46:38debt but it often can take more than
- 00:46:40just one day or one weekend of quality
- 00:46:44sleep how long does it take so my
- 00:46:46Studies have suggested multiple weeks uh
- 00:46:48will really be beneficial to paying back
- 00:46:51more of your sleep debt than just a
- 00:46:53night or two nights of sleep the biggest
- 00:46:56bankr tends to be in the first week or
- 00:46:58two but obviously this depends on how
- 00:46:59much more you're actually getting how
- 00:47:01you're timing that in your night but the
- 00:47:04bottom line is that if you can invest
- 00:47:06maybe a week or maybe if you have a
- 00:47:08vacation coming up and you do two weeks
- 00:47:10that's going to be U the biggest impact
- 00:47:13on paying back your sleep debt and if
- 00:47:15you say hey that sounds like a long time
- 00:47:17Dr ma well even potentially like 5 days
- 00:47:20is one of my preliminary studies had
- 00:47:22suggested in professional baseball
- 00:47:24players even if it's 5 days of getting
- 00:47:26one additional hour of sleep that was
- 00:47:29shown to potential that was shown to
- 00:47:31improve cognitive reaction time and also
- 00:47:34processing speed in the athletes that
- 00:47:37actually got one additional hour so if
- 00:47:38you got six hours you went to seven if
- 00:47:40you got seven hours you went to eight
- 00:47:42hours versus the athletes that just
- 00:47:43continue to get their normal sleep
- 00:47:46interesting I I guess I've got to
- 00:47:47understand what this concept or this
- 00:47:50idea of sleep Deb is because I I want to
- 00:47:52make sure I'm super clear on what it is
- 00:47:53and isn't cuz when you say the word debt
- 00:47:55I assume it's kind of like I I owe
- 00:47:57the Sleep bank manager a couple of hours
- 00:48:00um but but I I've kind of gone back on
- 00:48:03forward on this idea of sleep debt I
- 00:48:05think some people have told me that it's
- 00:48:06real some people have told me that it's
- 00:48:07not real um and I don't know where where
- 00:48:09I should stand on it so if I if I
- 00:48:12haven't so for example I flew into La
- 00:48:14first couple of nights my sleep wasn't
- 00:48:15great am I still but I had good sleep
- 00:48:18last night am I still paying for it now
- 00:48:21the way I explain the concept of sleep
- 00:48:22dead is that your body requires a
- 00:48:24certain amount every single night again
- 00:48:26we talked but individual variability but
- 00:48:28let's just say you need 8 hours every
- 00:48:31night and conceptually if you don't meet
- 00:48:33that 8 hours then you build up a debt so
- 00:48:35if you're only getting six hours a night
- 00:48:36you now have two hours of debt built up
- 00:48:38if you go Monday to Friday that's 5 days
- 00:48:40now you have 10 hours built
- 00:48:42up right two hours every night becomes
- 00:48:4510 hours and if you then sleep in on a
- 00:48:47Saturday and you get let's just say 10
- 00:48:49hours of sleep you've paid back two of
- 00:48:52those hours but you still have eight
- 00:48:54hours left to go and my buddy knows yes
- 00:48:57so conceptually that's the idea of
- 00:48:59accumulating sleep debt I do stand in
- 00:49:00the camp that believes that that does
- 00:49:02accumulate over time we do think that
- 00:49:05you can pay back some of that debt on
- 00:49:07the short term right so what you lost
- 00:49:10like you said this past day or this past
- 00:49:12week maybe this past month you should
- 00:49:14pay that back with getting extra sleep
- 00:49:17or we call Sleep extension we don't
- 00:49:19think that you can Surplus and Bank more
- 00:49:24and that you can pull from that in the
- 00:49:25future but we re recognize that if
- 00:49:27you've got insufficient sleep that if
- 00:49:30you extend it over a couple of days
- 00:49:33maybe a couple weeks then you will see
- 00:49:35benefits in your reaction time in your
- 00:49:37fatigue levels in your performance
- 00:49:39outcomes and so we do recommend that as
- 00:49:41a tool especially if you know that
- 00:49:44you're going to have a day where you're
- 00:49:46going to have sleep loss so it's a
- 00:49:49strategy for example if you know okay in
- 00:49:51a week I'm going to have a project and
- 00:49:54I'm not going to be getting enough sleep
- 00:49:56that night night then what you can do in
- 00:49:58the days leading up to it is getting
- 00:50:00sufficient sleep but arguably even more
- 00:50:03so that we know when it gets to that
- 00:50:05project the decrements that you'll
- 00:50:07experience tend to be less robust than
- 00:50:09if you went into it with just say that
- 00:50:11was 5 hours so what evidence do you have
- 00:50:14that sleep debt is a real thing what's
- 00:50:16the first thing that comes to mind so my
- 00:50:19my what I've dedicated my career to is
- 00:50:21trying to understand how to pay back
- 00:50:23sleep debt with sleep extension
- 00:50:25interventions so what that means is
- 00:50:28typically I'm working with a number of
- 00:50:29Collegiate athletes where many of them
- 00:50:31are not getting what they need because
- 00:50:33when we start these studies many of them
- 00:50:35have high fatigue levels they are
- 00:50:37reacting slowly we often see lapses in
- 00:50:40their um their judgment and their
- 00:50:43ability to ultimately perform and
- 00:50:46function which is what they consider
- 00:50:49their Baseline but then when we actually
- 00:50:52challenge them by paying back some of
- 00:50:54that debt by getting additional hours
- 00:50:57when we monitor the the differences that
- 00:50:59can make over multiple weeks that's
- 00:51:01where we see there's Improvement in the
- 00:51:03reaction time their fatigue levels drop
- 00:51:07their performance on the field improves
- 00:51:10and so we recognize what has changed in
- 00:51:13this is trying to pay back some of that
- 00:51:15accumulated debt when the rest of their
- 00:51:18training has been held consistent where
- 00:51:20we've been trying to maintain the rest
- 00:51:22of their their training which is key
- 00:51:24which is the key point because in my
- 00:51:26mind I go well maybe if you've got the
- 00:51:29athlete to sleep well on that first
- 00:51:30night then when they've showed up to
- 00:51:32training they've trained a little bit
- 00:51:33harder they've built their muscles a
- 00:51:35little bit more they've had better
- 00:51:36recovery in their muscles so
- 00:51:39then the next day the same thing happens
- 00:51:41because they've slept so it's actually
- 00:51:43just that they're training better which
- 00:51:45is causing them to improve their that's
- 00:51:46fair we we've tried to hold their
- 00:51:48training to be consistent and choosing
- 00:51:50periods where their training isn't going
- 00:51:52to vary significantly as well as you can
- 00:51:55almost make the argument too that
- 00:51:56sometimes as the season goes on athletes
- 00:51:59get more fatigued more tired and that
- 00:52:02can be actually a decrement to how
- 00:52:04they'll perform so when we see the
- 00:52:05benefits come down the road as the
- 00:52:07season potentially gets even longer that
- 00:52:09at least is some suggestion that the
- 00:52:11intervention of sleep while we also have
- 00:52:13the measures of how much more they were
- 00:52:16getting actually were at least
- 00:52:18associated with these performance
- 00:52:19outcomes because REM one of the key
- 00:52:22things about REM sleep which is the sort
- 00:52:23of final stage of sleep is that it helps
- 00:52:25with Muscle Recovery uh deep sleep is
- 00:52:28actually deep sleep is where we uh deep
- 00:52:31sleep is where it's implied that there's
- 00:52:33more R Muscle Recovery regeneration
- 00:52:35because there's the biggest pulse of
- 00:52:36growth hormone during your deep sleep so
- 00:52:39to back up a bit you have light stages
- 00:52:41of sleep then you have deep stages of
- 00:52:43sleep and then you have that rapid eye
- 00:52:45movement sleep or when you dream that is
- 00:52:48tends to be more associated with
- 00:52:50consolidation of learning in memory and
- 00:52:53skill consolidation so you go through
- 00:52:55these Cycles during the night time about
- 00:52:5790 to 120 minutes but the proportion
- 00:53:00changes through the night the beginning
- 00:53:02of the night you get more of that deep
- 00:53:04sleep and then in the early morning
- 00:53:06hours is when you get more of that REM
- 00:53:08sleep so you might have woken up in an
- 00:53:10earlier morning and had the recall of
- 00:53:12these vivid dreams it's because you
- 00:53:14often will be waking up from the that
- 00:53:16REM sleep yes that happened last night
- 00:53:18actually CU I woke up suspiciously early
- 00:53:20for me so I woke up at about 5 or 6:00
- 00:53:23and I was just kind of dipping in and
- 00:53:24out of Dreams MH and were very vivid
- 00:53:27dreams that I can still remember now
- 00:53:28yeah um so the muscle memory element of
- 00:53:32all of this what is muscle memory and
- 00:53:34how is that sort of implicated with
- 00:53:36sleep so muscle memory there's different
- 00:53:39types of memory and you need sleep think
- 00:53:42of sleep as hitting that save button
- 00:53:44right you need to sleep after you have
- 00:53:47learned new information learned a new
- 00:53:49skill so that you can consolidate those
- 00:53:53those uh those memories and be able to
- 00:53:55retrieve it later so I always use an
- 00:53:58analogy of hitting that save button
- 00:54:00after you learn new material or learn a
- 00:54:02new skill set you need to go home and
- 00:54:04sleep so that it goes into long-term
- 00:54:05storage and that you can retrieve that
- 00:54:07the following day and subsequently
- 00:54:09without that sleep we know that that
- 00:54:11groundwork for that new skill or that
- 00:54:14new memory is not going to be as strong
- 00:54:17and so in the context of students who
- 00:54:20are trying to study for a test or an
- 00:54:22athlete that's trying to remember the
- 00:54:24Playbook you want to space those
- 00:54:27intervals that you're learning that
- 00:54:28material and have sleep that follows so
- 00:54:31that you strengthen those
- 00:54:34connections and also you mentioned when
- 00:54:36you were talking about one of your
- 00:54:37athletes encouraging them to nap before
- 00:54:40a game yes um I I read this fascinating
- 00:54:44word in the research that I was doing on
- 00:54:46your work I think it's napino yes what's
- 00:54:49a napino the nappuccino so this is a
- 00:54:52useful tool if you're trying to have a
- 00:54:55temporary boost and aler and performance
- 00:54:57so the nappuccino you go and take your
- 00:55:00favorite caffeinated beverage the
- 00:55:02caffeine will start to kick in in about
- 00:55:0415 minutes and you go and then take your
- 00:55:0720 to 30 minute power nap so if you're
- 00:55:10able to fall asleep within that 5 to 10
- 00:55:12minutes while the caffeine will start to
- 00:55:14come on board then when you wake up
- 00:55:16after 20 to 30 minutes then bam both the
- 00:55:18caffeine will have kicked in and the
- 00:55:20power naap will have kicked in and
- 00:55:22there's research to show that that's
- 00:55:23more effective for alertness and
- 00:55:26performance Improvement for a couple of
- 00:55:28hours than if you only did the caffeine
- 00:55:30alone or only did the power nap alone so
- 00:55:33the nappuccino is is a useful tool for
- 00:55:36some who who utilize caffeine and you
- 00:55:39can partner that together with a short
- 00:55:4120 to 30 minute nap so if I wanted to
- 00:55:43take a nap now I have an espresso and
- 00:55:47then go and have my nap exactly yes the
- 00:55:50cettas you do need to fall asleep within
- 00:55:52about 10 minutes or else the caffeine
- 00:55:54will start to come on board but if if
- 00:55:56you do this in the late morning or early
- 00:55:58afternoon it can be a helpful tool so
- 00:56:00that you have a boost in your alertness
- 00:56:02for a couple of hours and I grew up
- 00:56:05thinking that naps didn't work because
- 00:56:07the minute I learned about sleep and
- 00:56:08these sleep cycles and that it takes I
- 00:56:10don't know 45 60 Minutes whatever it is
- 00:56:12to get into late stage sleep like the
- 00:56:14Rems sleep the deep sleep I thought
- 00:56:16what's the point taking a 15 20 minute
- 00:56:18nap if I'm not going to get into deep or
- 00:56:20REM sleep so there's benefit of just
- 00:56:22that 15minute nap you mentioned you want
- 00:56:24to stay in lighter stages of sleep cuz
- 00:56:26there's benefits of lighter stages of
- 00:56:28sleep and that can give you that
- 00:56:30alertness and performance boost even
- 00:56:32when you're in lighter stages of sleep
- 00:56:34you actually don't want to go into
- 00:56:35deeper stages of sleep because when you
- 00:56:37take the longer naps as I think you you
- 00:56:40might have shared you you've taken the
- 00:56:412-hour nap the three p you wake up and
- 00:56:43you're much more sluggish much more
- 00:56:45groggy that's not a good state for you
- 00:56:48to go out and then do you know work
- 00:56:52after that or it's not the state that
- 00:56:53you want to be if you're a a basketball
- 00:56:55player and have to go and play a game
- 00:56:58but those deeper stages you come out of
- 00:57:00what we call Sleep inertia with that
- 00:57:01sluggishness and so it can also affect
- 00:57:04your sleep at night and make it harder
- 00:57:06to sleep subsequently so you actually
- 00:57:08want to stay in those lighter stages of
- 00:57:10sleep and keep those naps very short so
- 00:57:12what's the maximum length that a nap
- 00:57:14should be I like 30 minutes okay yes so
- 00:57:17you can time that by setting an alarm if
- 00:57:20it takes you 5 or 10 minutes to fall
- 00:57:22asleep you can plan for that as well and
- 00:57:24the setting alarm to wake yourself up 30
- 00:57:26minutes later I think it's a great
- 00:57:28strategy when again you don't get
- 00:57:30sufficient sleep at night or you had
- 00:57:32poor sleep leading into that night and
- 00:57:34you need a little bit of a boost later
- 00:57:36in the day what do you think of the
- 00:57:37snooze button the snooze button I'm not
- 00:57:41a huge fan of the snooze um I fully
- 00:57:44understand why people love to hit the
- 00:57:45snooze and then go back to bed uh and if
- 00:57:48you're someone who does that one of my
- 00:57:50suggestions is just to cut down so that
- 00:57:52you only hit the snooze once 5 minutes
- 00:57:54later start your day the reason why is
- 00:57:57because it helps to maximize your rem or
- 00:58:00your dreaming sleep in those early
- 00:58:01morning hours if you can actually sleep
- 00:58:04Consolidated all the way until the time
- 00:58:05you have to wake up so for example if
- 00:58:07you're someone who hits the snooze
- 00:58:09button five times every five minutes for
- 00:58:12a half hour it means that you're having
- 00:58:14very interrupted sleep for the last half
- 00:58:17hour of your night versus if you just
- 00:58:20let yourself sleep Consolidated all the
- 00:58:22way through and then maybe hit the
- 00:58:24snooze button just one time and then got
- 00:58:26yourself up to start your day it means
- 00:58:28you would have given yourself another 25
- 00:58:31minutes of Consolidated sleep likely
- 00:58:33that dreaming REM sleep that's so
- 00:58:35important for learning and memory and so
- 00:58:38that is one just easy adjustment that
- 00:58:40you can make in terms of your morning
- 00:58:43approach to maximizing what you get
- 00:58:45during the night so what's the what's
- 00:58:46the value in consolidating it versus
- 00:58:48just having fragmented sleep yeah so
- 00:58:51then if you're getting a lot of that REM
- 00:58:53sleep in those early morning hours and
- 00:58:55you're snoozing you're going to be
- 00:58:57waking up and coming out of that REM
- 00:58:59sleep so you likely are changing the
- 00:59:01stages of sleep you would be getting in
- 00:59:03those early hours so you would then be
- 00:59:05awake and then probably going into
- 00:59:07lighter stages of sleep awake lighter
- 00:59:09stages of sleep than necessarily having
- 00:59:11a solid REM period all the way until you
- 00:59:14wake up what's the cost of that so
- 00:59:16learning a memory and consolidation is
- 00:59:19definitely one area that we recognize is
- 00:59:22associated with that REM sleep and so
- 00:59:24you want as we talked about it changes
- 00:59:26through the night you want to have as
- 00:59:27much as possible but you part have to
- 00:59:30have just the duration so when you get
- 00:59:32the most of it in the morning hours if
- 00:59:34you cut that short and either wake up
- 00:59:36earlier or you're snoozing and you're
- 00:59:38interrupting it you're not going to
- 00:59:40maximize the value you get of the hours
- 00:59:43in rem okay so I just want to make sure
- 00:59:45that I those 25 minutes I give them to
- 00:59:48REM sleep versus just giving them to
- 00:59:51little fragmented light sleep exactly so
- 00:59:54I'm better off just putting my alarm to
- 00:59:57the time that I actually have to get out
- 00:59:58of bed exactly just to maximize the
- 00:59:59amount of R sleep that I get to
- 01:00:01consolidate my memories are you a
- 01:00:02snoozer no not really okay well I mean
- 01:00:06we all have our moments but not really I
- 01:00:09can't remember the last time I pressed
- 01:00:10pressed the snooze button but the thing
- 01:00:12that I do and I'm not sure if this is a
- 01:00:13good idea or not is because I have told
- 01:00:17myself and I say told myself because I'm
- 01:00:18quite conscious of the BS that I believe
- 01:00:20about myself but um I've told myself
- 01:00:23that I'm like an alow chronotype or
- 01:00:24something which by the way I don't even
- 01:00:26know if it's true and I don't know if
- 01:00:27chronotypes are true um and I typically
- 01:00:31work quite late and I love working late
- 01:00:33I get better ideas late I do my writing
- 01:00:35pretty late at night as well and so what
- 01:00:37I've done in my life is I've basically
- 01:00:39made sure that I don't have any meetings
- 01:00:40or any engagements before 11:00 so even
- 01:00:44like this podcast today started at 11:00
- 01:00:46yes um basically nothing in my life
- 01:00:48starts till 11:00 for that very reason
- 01:00:51just to because if I do end up staying
- 01:00:53up a little bit late I want to be able
- 01:00:54to kind of sleep through without having
- 01:00:56to set an alarm and just wake up
- 01:00:57naturally what do you think of that is
- 01:00:59that suboptimal no I think it's a great
- 01:01:02strategy so there are chronotypes where
- 01:01:05you've mentioned you're more of an
- 01:01:06evening owl you go to bed later you like
- 01:01:08to wake up later as a natural
- 01:01:10predilection is is that real or I just
- 01:01:12myself this is justifying myself no
- 01:01:15there is a natural tendency for some to
- 01:01:17feel like they are evening owls and
- 01:01:19there's others who feel like they do
- 01:01:21much better in the morning so they go to
- 01:01:22bed earlier they wake up earlier they're
- 01:01:24more productive in the morning those are
- 01:01:25are morning Larks and then there is a
- 01:01:28group that's somewhere in the middle
- 01:01:29that don't strongly lean one way or
- 01:01:31another but really what you're doing is
- 01:01:33you're you're making your sleep work to
- 01:01:35your your chronotype and to your
- 01:01:37advantage where you do feel like you're
- 01:01:39more productive in the evenings and then
- 01:01:41you want to be able to maximize your
- 01:01:42sleep waking up without an alarm and
- 01:01:44starting your day later I think that's
- 01:01:46like a great strategy because a lot of
- 01:01:47people aren't able to have that
- 01:01:50flexibility and so Society often will
- 01:01:52force particularly the night owls onto
- 01:01:55an earlier schedule where you have to
- 01:01:57wake up whether to go to work or other
- 01:01:59obligations or kids earlier Point yeah
- 01:02:03and and then you're cutting your sleep
- 01:02:05short like you mentioned like with
- 01:02:07school and then we're getting these um
- 01:02:10and then you're on a schedule that
- 01:02:12doesn't work synergistically with what
- 01:02:14your chronotype is they should do some
- 01:02:16studies on kids in school and like
- 01:02:18Disobedience and ability to pay
- 01:02:20attention and do homework in grades
- 01:02:22because honestly I was so useless in
- 01:02:24school and I really I really think of it
- 01:02:26now I'm not entirely sure here because I
- 01:02:29got diagnosed with ADHD when I was like
- 01:02:3030 years old so part of me thinks I've
- 01:02:31just got like a very active brain and
- 01:02:34part part of having an active brain
- 01:02:35meant that late at night I was Finding
- 01:02:36ways to stimulate it by playing Video
- 01:02:38Games Etc so that might just be the
- 01:02:40reason but the other reason might be
- 01:02:41that I'm an Al Chron type and I found it
- 01:02:43really hard to get up at like 7:30 to
- 01:02:46get to go to school by sort of 8:30ish
- 01:02:50and so I would miss school I would show
- 01:02:52up knacked I would sleep in lessons um
- 01:02:56and I feel like school just starts way
- 01:02:58too early for kids it's a ongoing uh
- 01:03:01it's an ongoing problem and actually in
- 01:03:03a very interesting way there has been a
- 01:03:06change to school start times
- 01:03:07particularly in California um this this
- 01:03:10year was the first year that school
- 01:03:12start start times for high schools and
- 01:03:14for middle schools was shifted much
- 01:03:16later because there are studies to show
- 01:03:18that our when our students are better
- 01:03:20rested they have higher attendance rates
- 01:03:22their GPA and grades are much higher
- 01:03:24there's less mental health issues um
- 01:03:27there's less car accidents and so this
- 01:03:29these Studies have um been over the last
- 01:03:32decade and longer in which they have
- 01:03:34built evidence to help make decisions to
- 01:03:38start school time later um and that is
- 01:03:42in California been enacted this year and
- 01:03:44some other states are starting to follow
- 01:03:46suit but to your point what makes it
- 01:03:48challenging is that at the age of high
- 01:03:51school many of those body clocks are
- 01:03:53shifted and so students St want to an
- 01:03:56adolescence go to bed later and wake up
- 01:03:59later naturally that's just how our
- 01:04:00sleep changes through the life cycle but
- 01:04:03when they stay up late and then we cut
- 01:04:05their sleep short by forcing them to get
- 01:04:06up really early for school now they have
- 01:04:09insufficient sleep and that builds like
- 01:04:11a sleep debt and so they're not setting
- 01:04:13themselves up for success in school for
- 01:04:15learning and memory so that's where
- 01:04:16again there's more evidence of if we can
- 01:04:18shift the school start time get these
- 01:04:20students to have a little bit more sleep
- 01:04:22they ultimately are better prepared for
- 01:04:25school come to school have less uh car
- 01:04:28accidents and are just healthier
- 01:04:30students do you think there's anything
- 01:04:31parents need to know about sleep when it
- 01:04:34as it relates to their children and
- 01:04:36sleep hygiene with their children I
- 01:04:38think it's important for parents to
- 01:04:40start at the early early years of
- 01:04:43instilling good sleep habits a good
- 01:04:45sleep routine and giving their their
- 01:04:48children the tools and skills to be able
- 01:04:52to make sure that it's a priority as
- 01:04:54they go through early childhood into
- 01:04:56adolescence and hopefully then sets
- 01:04:58themselves up for making sure it's a
- 01:05:00priority for their adult life um I'm a
- 01:05:03young parent myself I just had uh my
- 01:05:05first son and so um I recognize and can
- 01:05:08empathize with the TR the struggles of
- 01:05:11getting sufficient sleep when they're
- 01:05:12very young but then trying to instill
- 01:05:15how they can approach their sleep from
- 01:05:17early age I think would be incredibly
- 01:05:19helpful to also just change culturally
- 01:05:20how we think about sleep because so many
- 01:05:23of us now have never learned about sleep
- 01:05:25for or what we should do until you're an
- 01:05:27adult but if we can make that change
- 01:05:29earlier on I think we're going to have
- 01:05:31healthier kids better families um who
- 01:05:34are better rested and and also just this
- 01:05:37generation where we recognize this is so
- 01:05:39important that we shouldn't sacrifice it
- 01:05:41because we're doing ourselves a
- 01:05:42disservice to letting us be the best
- 01:05:45that we can possibly be how old is your
- 01:05:47son 11 months 11 months so how are you
- 01:05:49sleeping oh I transparently am quite
- 01:05:52tired okay I I as a yeah new Young mom
- 01:05:56also um I don't have the ideal sleep
- 01:05:58that I know I would love um it's a for a
- 01:06:02short time but I'm trying to be
- 01:06:03strategic of the things that I can do
- 01:06:06with some of the tools that we've talked
- 01:06:08about trying to leverage power naps um
- 01:06:10when for example I do have to still wake
- 01:06:12up during the night time to tend to him
- 01:06:14um and you know the early morning starts
- 01:06:16are not always consistent so my sleep
- 01:06:19schedule is not always consistent so you
- 01:06:21know going back to those three buckets
- 01:06:24we talked about earlier like if I don't
- 01:06:26get the full duration that I want then
- 01:06:28how do I maximize the quality right I've
- 01:06:30optimized my sleep environment I try to
- 01:06:32have a process to wind down at nighttime
- 01:06:35um or the timing you know is and the
- 01:06:37sleep schedule is another area that you
- 01:06:39can still work on when for example you
- 01:06:41may not be getting the duration um so
- 01:06:44these are strategies that I try to
- 01:06:45employ when I know that I um also am a
- 01:06:48work in progress and trying to get the
- 01:06:50best sleep possible Once Upon a Time if
- 01:06:52you had a business idea it was
- 01:06:54exceptionally difficult to get going but
- 01:06:57now in the age of Shopify it is
- 01:07:01exceptionally easy as many of you will
- 01:07:03know Shopify are a sponsor of this
- 01:07:05podcast if you don't know Shopify it's
- 01:07:07an exceptionally simple web platform for
- 01:07:09anybody that's got an idea that wants to
- 01:07:11transact on a global scale so things
- 01:07:14like these conversation cards which we
- 01:07:15sell we've sold using Shopify and it
- 01:07:18only took us a couple of clicks to get
- 01:07:21going so why did we choose Shopify for a
- 01:07:23number of reasons but I think one of the
- 01:07:24big ones which goes and appreciated is
- 01:07:26their checkout system converts 36%
- 01:07:28better compared to other platforms and
- 01:07:31here's what I'm going to do to remove
- 01:07:33the cost for you if you go to
- 01:07:34shopify.com Bartlet you'll be able to
- 01:07:37try Shopify for
- 01:07:39$1 a month I've seen Shopify completely
- 01:07:43change people's lives and for many of
- 01:07:45you I think it could change yours what
- 01:07:47are the other examples of sort of case
- 01:07:50studies that you're you're most proud of
- 01:07:52or that were most pivotal in shaping
- 01:07:53your thinking about sleep I mentioned
- 01:07:56the Philadelphia Eagles back in 2017 and
- 01:07:59tried to help them educate their players
- 01:08:02about sleep how to have a more strategic
- 01:08:04approach to their wind down routine to
- 01:08:07thinking about how they're integrating
- 01:08:09sleep into their training practices and
- 01:08:12thinking about ultimately how they
- 01:08:14travel and and having for example
- 01:08:16strategies to minimize jet lag when
- 01:08:18you're Crossing time zones and having to
- 01:08:20play in different locations than the
- 01:08:22give me some of those then so some the
- 01:08:24tips you'd give me someone that travels
- 01:08:26a lot yeah um pre- during and post
- 01:08:28travel yeah what should I be thinking
- 01:08:30about before I travel while I'm
- 01:08:31traveling and after I I land yes so have
- 01:08:34a a game plan for every trip I think
- 01:08:37most people have no strategies in place
- 01:08:38when they travel they just get onto an
- 01:08:40airplane get to a new location and try
- 01:08:42to adjust when they get there that is
- 01:08:44not really a great strategy you want to
- 01:08:46have at least a pre-flight strategy
- 01:08:48inflight strategy and post-flight
- 01:08:50strategies because that will set
- 01:08:51yourself up better to minimize jet lag
- 01:08:54also travel fatigue and ultimately then
- 01:08:57be able to acclimate faster if you're
- 01:08:59Crossing multiple time zones before
- 01:09:01pre-flight try not to panic pack I know
- 01:09:03all of us do do Panic packing right
- 01:09:06before bed right before we're getting on
- 01:09:07a flight um so you want to try and be
- 01:09:10strategic and pack early you want to get
- 01:09:12at least why do I want to not panic pack
- 01:09:14because most people will Panic pack the
- 01:09:16night before they they have a flight and
- 01:09:17then they'll cut their sleep short so
- 01:09:19they'll get only say 5 hours of sleep
- 01:09:21because they're staying up late trying
- 01:09:22to pack everything and get ready for
- 01:09:24that early morning flight or for the
- 01:09:26next day well I I pack the morning of
- 01:09:28travel so okay but I'm I'm out here in
- 01:09:31La for I'm out here for 2 weeks and I
- 01:09:33packed a carryon carryon suitcase okay
- 01:09:36cuz I so look at what I'm wearing I wear
- 01:09:38just the same outfit every day so I have
- 01:09:39like the same outfit um but I pack
- 01:09:42literally an hour before I go to the
- 01:09:43airport okay okay so but you're right it
- 01:09:45does cut my sleep because I could have
- 01:09:47been in bed whether it's beginning of
- 01:09:49the day or the end of the day if it's
- 01:09:51affecting then the duration of your
- 01:09:53sleep I would recommend trying to a
- 01:09:55little more strategic and do it a day
- 01:09:57before two days before don't pain it
- 01:09:59pack number two try to get at least
- 01:10:02those seven hours if not
- 01:10:04your your amount of sleep that makes you
- 01:10:07feel like you're functioning and
- 01:10:08Performing well um at least a day if not
- 01:10:11two days if you get insufficient sleep
- 01:10:13before you get onto an airplane jet lag
- 01:10:15will be worse and that travel fatigue
- 01:10:17can feel much more robust and you're
- 01:10:20more likely to have the quas on in the
- 01:10:21airport which is going to destroy the
- 01:10:23whole thing for for you so those are
- 01:10:26things that you can do before flight
- 01:10:27depending on where you're going you can
- 01:10:29actually start to adjust your body clock
- 01:10:31before you even get onto the airplane so
- 01:10:33let's just take a 3-hour time difference
- 01:10:36here in the US if you're in the west
- 01:10:38coast and you're going to the east coast
- 01:10:39three time zones you can actually start
- 01:10:41to go to bed a half hour early wake up a
- 01:10:45half hour early do that for two or 3
- 01:10:48days and and get sunlight in the morning
- 01:10:51because that sunlight reinforces to your
- 01:10:53brain to start to shift that body clock
- 01:10:56so if you can do that a day before 2
- 01:10:58days before maybe 3 days before when you
- 01:11:00actually get to the new location you
- 01:11:01don't have to shift your body clock
- 01:11:03three time zones you've already shifted
- 01:11:05it one time zone or two time zones
- 01:11:08because the rule of thumb is for every
- 01:11:09time zone you cross it takes about a day
- 01:11:12to re acclimate even if you feel better
- 01:11:14after the first day usually jetti feels
- 01:11:17the worst in that first day when you
- 01:11:18arrive um but physiologically you
- 01:11:21haven't really adjusted fully even if
- 01:11:24it's over you know a couple of days so
- 01:11:26that's the rule of thumb so those are
- 01:11:27some things pre-flight you can do when
- 01:11:29you're in Flight you want to hydrate
- 01:11:32throughout the flight because
- 01:11:33dehydration can worsen jet lag you want
- 01:11:35to think about getting onto the new time
- 01:11:37zone schedule so again depending on
- 01:11:40which direction you're flying and how
- 01:11:41many times when you're Crossing you want
- 01:11:43to start to synchronize perhaps like
- 01:11:45when you're actually sleeping or some of
- 01:11:47your meal times so that you're getting
- 01:11:48onto that schedule and then you partner
- 01:11:51that with for example building a travel
- 01:11:53sleep kit I'm a huge fan of investing in
- 01:11:55sleep tools that will help you sleep
- 01:11:58when you need to in non- ideal
- 01:11:59situations whether you're on the plane
- 01:12:01and now trying to take a nap or shift
- 01:12:03your sleep schedule then you actually
- 01:12:05have an eye mask and ear plugs you have
- 01:12:07noise cancelling headphones you have
- 01:12:09your own travel pillow you have the
- 01:12:12tools with you to S drugs sorry sleeping
- 01:12:15medication okay so some uh medications
- 01:12:18can be helpful like melatonin
- 01:12:21particularly if you're trying to advance
- 01:12:22your clock has um evidence that it can
- 01:12:25help shift that a little bit more
- 01:12:26quickly when you're trying to advance
- 01:12:28your clock earlier would you recommend
- 01:12:30it to athletes um it I would say if it's
- 01:12:33something that you've used before and
- 01:12:35you know that you don't experience some
- 01:12:37of the side effects it could be a useful
- 01:12:39tool so melatonin while it's one of the
- 01:12:41most commonly used supplements and sleep
- 01:12:43aids there are still side effects that
- 01:12:45to be wary of so specifically for
- 01:12:47athletes too you can feel more groggy
- 01:12:49and sluggish when you wake up from it um
- 01:12:51it's not regulated by the the FDA here
- 01:12:55in the US and so you don't always know
- 01:12:57what's actually in those supplements so
- 01:12:59for my lead athletes they use what's
- 01:13:01called NSF Sports certified versions um
- 01:13:04they're just there's more um regulation
- 01:13:06around them but in for the for the you
- 01:13:09know everyday person you know there's a
- 01:13:11study where they looked at the amount of
- 01:13:13melatone that was actually in a variety
- 01:13:15of these supplements and it was a wide
- 01:13:17range from over 400% of what was on the
- 01:13:20label to obviously sub you know you know
- 01:13:23uh under 100% of what they actually
- 01:13:25indicated so there's a wide range of
- 01:13:27what's actually going to be in the
- 01:13:28supplement but it can help particularly
- 01:13:31when you're on travel with um re
- 01:13:34acclimating my team here we most of them
- 01:13:36use a certain app when we travel and it
- 01:13:39just tells you basically you say where
- 01:13:41you're going and then it'll tell you
- 01:13:42what time to eat what time not to eat
- 01:13:45Etc so you can get aligned with that
- 01:13:47with your destinations like circadian
- 01:13:49rhythm I guess so we'll link below one
- 01:13:51of the apps that our team use we're not
- 01:13:53affiliated with them in any way but
- 01:13:55we're flying out here I know will and my
- 01:13:56team sent me a screenshot and said Steve
- 01:13:57this is what time you need to be eating
- 01:13:59and everything cuz we're going to La so
- 01:14:01it's been super helpful for all of us I
- 01:14:03I'll link that below because I know some
- 01:14:04people are going to be wondering what
- 01:14:05apps they should be using so we're in
- 01:14:07the flight we've got our postt trvel
- 01:14:09flight kit with the ey masks and all
- 01:14:11those kinds of things in we've got our
- 01:14:13app is we're
- 01:14:15hydrated um noise cancelling headphones
- 01:14:18is there anything else we need to be
- 01:14:19thinking about while we're traveling
- 01:14:20when you're traveling so on a plane on a
- 01:14:23plane so we talked about hydration minim
- 01:14:26Al and caffeine or eliminating entirely
- 01:14:28is a straty inad of having on board
- 01:14:33because that can also potentially worsen
- 01:14:36um jet lag and or make it more difficult
- 01:14:38to sleep when you're actually trying to
- 01:14:40when you arrive and again seeking light
- 01:14:43that is the most powerful signal to your
- 01:14:45brain to help shift your body clock also
- 01:14:48bringing sunglasses so that you actually
- 01:14:50avoid sunlight at certain times because
- 01:14:52your body can respond differently
- 01:14:55depending again on your home location
- 01:14:57and how many time zones youve crossed so
- 01:14:58there's certain times that these apps
- 01:15:00can be helpful that will likely tell you
- 01:15:02you don't want to get sunlight during
- 01:15:04these hours and so you want to be
- 01:15:06strategic about that and just make sure
- 01:15:07you have sunglasses so that you can
- 01:15:09still go about your day but trying to
- 01:15:11minimize that sun exposure um getting
- 01:15:14well rested and getting sufficient sleep
- 01:15:16even if it might be a little bit more
- 01:15:18fragmented than usual just giving
- 01:15:19yourself at least a day to acclimate so
- 01:15:22that I would recommend not scheduling
- 01:15:23your most important meetings right when
- 01:15:25you get in or in that first day for
- 01:15:27athletes they don't want to do maximal
- 01:15:30exercise because there's a risk that
- 01:15:32that jetl could increase injury in that
- 01:15:35acute period so you want your body clock
- 01:15:37to be able to readjust and then using
- 01:15:39caffeine and power nap strategically so
- 01:15:42for example our afternoon 1 to 4:00 is
- 01:15:45typically when we have this dip in our
- 01:15:47alertness now when you get to a new time
- 01:15:49zone that can occur at a different time
- 01:15:51point in the day but strategically then
- 01:15:54you can use CA and and uh Power naaps to
- 01:15:57be able to help you through those lulls
- 01:15:59when you're in that new time zone what
- 01:16:02about sex sleep and sex in bed and that
- 01:16:05is it because I think so many people
- 01:16:07actually make the mistake of being in
- 01:16:10bed and being on their computer on their
- 01:16:12phone doing other work while they're
- 01:16:14awake and that actually helps strengthen
- 01:16:16that connection that when you're in bed
- 01:16:18you're awake and your brain will start
- 01:16:19to associate that so sleep and sex are
- 01:16:22all that you want in bed everything else
- 01:16:24should be outside so when we talked
- 01:16:25about that wind down routine or that
- 01:16:27racing mind all that should happen
- 01:16:29outside of bed because you want to
- 01:16:30actually tease apart that Association
- 01:16:33that your brain is making of being awake
- 01:16:35in bed and that will be one small
- 01:16:37adjustment that's helpful to to get
- 01:16:39better rest at night but will will sex
- 01:16:41improve or hurt my sleep I'm thinking
- 01:16:45you know CU I'm really trying to get out
- 01:16:47like should you be in bed with someone
- 01:16:48does it does it improve your sleep to
- 01:16:50sleep with someone and does sex have an
- 01:16:52impact on your sleep cuz I you know
- 01:16:55speaking from personal experience I
- 01:16:57think that if I have sex before bed I
- 01:16:58sleep better I don't think that there's
- 01:17:01great literature on sleep and sex out
- 01:17:03there but um I will say that there has
- 01:17:05been um there's definitely an impact
- 01:17:08potentially of a bed partner sleeping
- 01:17:10with you in bed because their movements
- 01:17:12can affect your sleep if they snore that
- 01:17:14can very much affect your waking up
- 01:17:17during the night time um and then you
- 01:17:20know with sex I think that that is
- 01:17:21something anecdotally some people will
- 01:17:23definitely say it helps them to be able
- 01:17:25to consolidate their sleep and they feel
- 01:17:26like the quality is better um but I
- 01:17:29don't think there's a lot of great
- 01:17:30studies that are are being funded for
- 01:17:32research right now what is the most
- 01:17:35popular question you typically get asked
- 01:17:36about sleep from people most popular
- 01:17:39question is napping which we've
- 01:17:40discussed keep them short 20 to 30
- 01:17:42minutes I I get asked a fair amount
- 01:17:45about can you oversleep so no we don't
- 01:17:48think you really you should you can
- 01:17:49overs sleep when some people say they
- 01:17:52get say 9 hours or 10 hours and feel
- 01:17:55much more groggy it's because often
- 01:17:57they've shifted their sleep schedule or
- 01:17:59they have an accumulated debt that say
- 01:18:01built up and then they're finally
- 01:18:02allowing their body to relax and so now
- 01:18:04that they're they're they don't have the
- 01:18:06mask of stimulating activities from
- 01:18:09their day or their work that can read I
- 01:18:11read I didn't read a study one of my
- 01:18:12podcast guests told me that there is a
- 01:18:15harm to oversleeping but I think from
- 01:18:17what I managed to
- 01:18:18ascertain the studies they were citing
- 01:18:22just proved that people who sleep for
- 01:18:23like 10 or 11 hours
- 01:18:25typically have a higher risk of um
- 01:18:27disease and mental health but then it's
- 01:18:29hard to establish cause and effect
- 01:18:31because if you're in bed for 11 hours
- 01:18:33maybe you're a depressed and B one would
- 01:18:35assume you're exercising and moving a
- 01:18:37little bit less so you probably got a
- 01:18:38lot of like cardiovascular issues yes so
- 01:18:41there are studies of looking at the more
- 01:18:43extremes of Less hours of sleep and then
- 01:18:45even more hours of sleep like the 10
- 01:18:47hours and obviously there can be other
- 01:18:49comorbid conditions uh that go along
- 01:18:52with individuals like who sleep much
- 01:18:54longer you mentioned you can sleep much
- 01:18:56longer because of depression or other um
- 01:18:59chronic health issues and so um that's a
- 01:19:01different context of thinking about
- 01:19:02oversleeping I think in the question I
- 01:19:04typically get is oh I slept one night of
- 01:19:0610 hours and I feel worse so I'm never
- 01:19:08going to do that again and that's
- 01:19:10actually not true right I think we want
- 01:19:12to have just more consistent hours that
- 01:19:14are timed so you're not having a shift
- 01:19:16in the bedtime and wake Time by like
- 01:19:18three hours later um because that could
- 01:19:20be why you're having that grogginess
- 01:19:21when you wake up not because you got the
- 01:19:2310 hours but because you're waking up up
- 01:19:24now at 11:00 a.m. instead of your
- 01:19:27typical you know 8:00 a.m. wake up time
- 01:19:29um you could be more dehydrated because
- 01:19:31of that longer time um snoring is one
- 01:19:34that I get asked a fair amount about is
- 01:19:37you know is it completely benign and I
- 01:19:39would say if you're snoring you should
- 01:19:41go talk with your primary care doctor
- 01:19:43and you should potentially ask about
- 01:19:45getting a sleep study there is Sleep
- 01:19:48Disorders like obstructive sleep apnea
- 01:19:50we mentioned before that's incredibly
- 01:19:52common and that's when that Airway has
- 01:19:54partial or full collapse and can lead to
- 01:19:56very fragmented sleep so you can wake up
- 01:19:58not refreshed because you really didn't
- 01:20:00get quality sleep during the night time
- 01:20:02and snoring I think in our society has
- 01:20:04become just an accepted Norm that can
- 01:20:06happen as you get older but that is not
- 01:20:08always the case that it is uh a benign a
- 01:20:12benign symptom and so um making sure
- 01:20:14that you talk to your primary care
- 01:20:16doctor and potentially get a sleep study
- 01:20:18I think is incredibly important is sleep
- 01:20:21apnea the the most common um disease
- 01:20:24disorder you see yes yes it
- 01:20:27isapa can be incredibly common I believe
- 01:20:30it's about 26% of people of people in
- 01:20:33the ages of 30 to 70 and so that as you
- 01:20:35imagine that's like one in four
- 01:20:37individuals but many individuals don't
- 01:20:40actually get tested or diagnosed and
- 01:20:43then treated until they're way into
- 01:20:45their adulthood or even pasted into
- 01:20:48their 6070s so with asleep apnea often
- 01:20:51times people will not wake up refreshed
- 01:20:53they will often feel tired in the
- 01:20:56daytime they may have a lot of caffeine
- 01:20:59or have to rely on power kns to keep
- 01:21:01their alertness up a lot of individuals
- 01:21:04will have early morning Awakenings so in
- 01:21:06those 3 4 5:00 in the morning they'll
- 01:21:08wake up and not realize why they're
- 01:21:09waking up frequently snoring can be very
- 01:21:12common if you've ever had a bed partner
- 01:21:14or a roommate and they've ever noted
- 01:21:16that you stop breathing or pause
- 01:21:18breathing or gasp and choke those are
- 01:21:22very suggestive that you might have
- 01:21:24sleep apnea um and again it is
- 01:21:27incredibly common but very manageable so
- 01:21:29something that I would highly recommend
- 01:21:31if you your bed partner your your
- 01:21:35roommate snore just uh suggest to have
- 01:21:38um I would suggest they go see their
- 01:21:40primary care doctor and typically is it
- 01:21:43people that are slightly overweight that
- 01:21:45are more likely and susceptible to
- 01:21:46having sleep apnea yes yes a lot of
- 01:21:49individuals who are overweight or obese
- 01:21:52um will be more at risk for Sleep back
- 01:21:54as you imagine the collapse of the
- 01:21:56airway typically is here around the neck
- 01:21:58and so more weight um typically is is
- 01:22:01not helpful for for apne but you can
- 01:22:03also be a very fit healthy young
- 01:22:06individual so I work with Elite athletes
- 01:22:08and I have a number of my professional
- 01:22:10athletes who again are young healthy
- 01:22:13males but their Anatomy is just more
- 01:22:16susceptible for this condition what are
- 01:22:18the um the big rebuttal you get the big
- 01:22:21excuses that you hear from people I
- 01:22:23don't have enough time
- 01:22:25yeah I don't have enough time to sleep
- 01:22:26okay I don't have enough time to sleep
- 01:22:28and what do you think of that one uh I
- 01:22:30don't think that that's true I think we
- 01:22:32we all are going to make sacrifices and
- 01:22:36priorities in our day and I think if you
- 01:22:39are saying you don't have enough time I
- 01:22:41think there's ways to be strategic about
- 01:22:43how you manage your time in the day I
- 01:22:45think we all have five minutes to
- 01:22:47implement a windown routine we can all
- 01:22:49do that at the very least I think all of
- 01:22:52us can um optim ize our environment I
- 01:22:56think we all can invest in some sleep
- 01:22:57tools I think we can make better choices
- 01:23:00about how you go about your day so you
- 01:23:02set yourself up better for sleep so I
- 01:23:04think that those are just small
- 01:23:05adjustments but will be huge in terms of
- 01:23:08what that will mean at night um I hear
- 01:23:11that you know I will sleep you know I'll
- 01:23:13sleep in the offseason right now in
- 01:23:16season is when I want to focus on being
- 01:23:17my best but really I think that's the a
- 01:23:20backwards way of thinking about it if
- 01:23:22you're thinking about optimizing your
- 01:23:24sleep when it gets to the season or the
- 01:23:26postseason when some of the most
- 01:23:27important games come down the line
- 01:23:29you're just playing catchup because if
- 01:23:31you have a sleep that built up and
- 01:23:33you're just trying to maintain that
- 01:23:34through the season you actually are at a
- 01:23:36deficit versus the other guy or growl on
- 01:23:40the team who has paid that back in the
- 01:23:42off seon now you have given yourself you
- 01:23:46know zero sleep debt you're at your best
- 01:23:48and now you're just trying to maintain
- 01:23:50that through the
- 01:23:51season what about injury what if I if
- 01:23:55I'm an athlete and I'm underslept are
- 01:23:57there any studies that suggest I'm more
- 01:23:59prone to injury there are a few studies
- 01:24:01that do suggest getting insufficient
- 01:24:03sleep so under 6 hours there's been more
- 01:24:06fatigue related injuries in adolescent
- 01:24:08athletes there's also a study that has
- 01:24:11looked at under eight hours of sleep
- 01:24:13still has a increased risk around 1.7
- 01:24:15fold higher of inj fold 170% yes yeah of
- 01:24:21higher risk of injury when you're
- 01:24:23getting under 8 hours of sleep versus
- 01:24:25those that got more than 8 hours of
- 01:24:27sleep and so I think it's unclear
- 01:24:29exactly why you're specifically more at
- 01:24:33risk for injury but I tried to take a
- 01:24:36look at the biomechanical changes of
- 01:24:39what happens when athletes are not
- 01:24:41getting sufficient sleep in one of my
- 01:24:43early studies um that has explored the
- 01:24:48biomechanical changes and what we showed
- 01:24:50is that when you're not getting
- 01:24:51sufficient sleep for multiple days you
- 01:24:53have more more variability in your
- 01:24:57biomechanics yeah so you're moving
- 01:24:59differently so you're not actually
- 01:25:00selecting probably your preferred
- 01:25:03coordination strategy so for example I
- 01:25:05had them doing a vertical jump and if
- 01:25:07you're well rested you likely should be
- 01:25:09able to do that very consistently as an
- 01:25:11elite athlete but when you're not well
- 01:25:14rested it's much more variable so
- 01:25:15they're moving differently and that may
- 01:25:17put people at risk for injury they like
- 01:25:20Landing differently a little bit jumping
- 01:25:22yeah how their knees their hips um are
- 01:25:24coordinated together differs and so that
- 01:25:27may put you at risk for injury down the
- 01:25:29road but more to come hopefully on that
- 01:25:31front there's just not that many studies
- 01:25:33that currently exist I've noticed
- 01:25:36something recently because recently I've
- 01:25:38had to get up quite early on a few occas
- 01:25:40so when I say early I mean I've had to
- 01:25:43go get wake up at 4:00 a.m. because I've
- 01:25:45got a flight at 6:00 a.m. and really
- 01:25:47interestingly if I so say if I go in bed
- 01:25:50at like 11:00 p.m. at night and I and I
- 01:25:52have to wake up at say 3:00 or 4:00 a.m.
- 01:25:54when I wake up at 3:00 or 4 a.m. I'm
- 01:25:56really hungry but if I wake up at 8:00
- 01:25:59a.m. M I'm not hungry well you are
- 01:26:02starting your day much earlier so your
- 01:26:04body clock is starting at a much earlier
- 01:26:06time than you typically would versus
- 01:26:088:00 so you almost have what we call
- 01:26:10socially jetlagged yourself right where
- 01:26:13you didn't get on an airplane yet but
- 01:26:15you literally shifted your whole sleep
- 01:26:17schedule to be an earlier wakeup time
- 01:26:20and so you can feel some of the symptoms
- 01:26:21of jet lag where you can have and you
- 01:26:24can have stomach GI upset you can feel
- 01:26:26more fatigued you can have those
- 01:26:28symptoms as if you gotone onto a new
- 01:26:30time zone and flew there but you hadn't
- 01:26:33yet if it it almost feels dare I say
- 01:26:37like hormonal like it because I was
- 01:26:39trying to understand what hunger is and
- 01:26:41hunger is essentially a bunch of
- 01:26:42hormones isn't it so yes you have
- 01:26:44certain hormones that regulate your
- 01:26:46appetite so leptin and gin are two
- 01:26:48hormones that impact your appetite um
- 01:26:52gin makes you more hungry leptin feels
- 01:26:55more satiated if you don't get
- 01:26:57sufficient sleep these levels can be
- 01:26:59imbalanced and so that's where people
- 01:27:02tend to as we've talked about grav
- 01:27:04gravitate towards you know carb and
- 01:27:07unhealthy Foods in the later evening
- 01:27:08time um but also when these are not well
- 01:27:11balanced that can also lead to weight
- 01:27:13gain or situations where you're not able
- 01:27:16to potentially um regulate your weight
- 01:27:18appropriately and so when I have
- 01:27:19individuals who are wondering about not
- 01:27:22making weight goals I ask them about
- 01:27:24their sleep and they don't recognize
- 01:27:25that sometimes being able to address how
- 01:27:27they sleep will actually help them to
- 01:27:29get to the weight management goals that
- 01:27:30they're really striving for Jack what
- 01:27:33about you we've talked about sleep
- 01:27:34before how how are you sleeping at the
- 01:27:35moment I've got pretty good at my sleep
- 01:27:38but waking up in the middle of the night
- 01:27:40you spoke about it in terms of like
- 01:27:41sleep happena but it feels like it
- 01:27:43should be normal to wake up so
- 01:27:46Awakenings actually can be very normal
- 01:27:49this is a very common question I get
- 01:27:50asked is you know should I never wake up
- 01:27:52at night and that's actually not true so
- 01:27:54you shouldn't necessarily hit your head
- 01:27:56on the pillow and then you're out for
- 01:27:58the full night and then never have an
- 01:27:59Awakening if you wake up you go to the
- 01:28:01bathroom one time you come back fall
- 01:28:03asleep in the 5 to 10 minutes great
- 01:28:05that's actually very normal um so you
- 01:28:09can have Awakenings that happen at even
- 01:28:12in the early morning hours and that can
- 01:28:14be just a typical part of your sleep
- 01:28:16cycle because it can be as your
- 01:28:17transitioning between these sleep stages
- 01:28:19that you'll have these Awakenings
- 01:28:21sometimes you'll consciously know that
- 01:28:22you're awake and other times you will
- 01:28:25unconsciously awaken um and so something
- 01:28:27like a wereable might actually show you
- 01:28:29that you have these Awakenings during
- 01:28:30the night time that you don't recall um
- 01:28:33but when it becomes very frequent then
- 01:28:35you have these Awakenings and over
- 01:28:37multiple weeks or it makes it more
- 01:28:40difficult and challenging than to
- 01:28:41function in the daytime that's when we
- 01:28:42get more concerned about Awakenings
- 01:28:44because there's a number of ways reasons
- 01:28:47why you can awaken at nighttime um to
- 01:28:49name a few it could be environmental
- 01:28:51factors that affect your sleep it could
- 01:28:53be that you had alcohol you know that
- 01:28:55right before bedtime maybe there's
- 01:28:57caffeine that's causing you to be awake
- 01:28:59there's also just stress or if you just
- 01:29:01have a racing mind that potentially
- 01:29:03could cuse those Awakenings a bed
- 01:29:05partner is something that is a common
- 01:29:07culprit um or underlying sleep apnea
- 01:29:10that can happen and so there's early
- 01:29:12Awakenings that need to be investigated
- 01:29:14with your doctor how much does um
- 01:29:16alcohol impact my sleep in percentage
- 01:29:18times I I don't know the specific
- 01:29:20statistics of how that's going to impact
- 01:29:23um um the the duration but I will say
- 01:29:26that when we look at the studies of
- 01:29:28moderate to high consumption of alcohol
- 01:29:30that very much has a association with
- 01:29:33more fragmented sleep more Awakenings
- 01:29:35during the night time and so the quality
- 01:29:37of your sleep is significantly impaired
- 01:29:40so if you're trying to um have an
- 01:29:42important meeting the following day an
- 01:29:44important game or you're just trying to
- 01:29:47be able to be your best that following
- 01:29:49day at least try to minimize or
- 01:29:51eliminate the alcohol or in the sleep in
- 01:29:53the sleep docks world we say drink when
- 01:29:55you wake up we'd rather you have that
- 01:29:57alcohol in the morning or the or the
- 01:30:00early afternoon not not necessarily
- 01:30:02right before bed and so um yeah that's
- 01:30:05that's one of the strategies is to
- 01:30:06eliminate the alcohol right before
- 01:30:08sleeping Dr M we have a closing
- 01:30:11tradition on this podcast where the last
- 01:30:12guest leaves a question for the next
- 01:30:13guest not knowing who they're going to
- 01:30:14leave it for and the question that has
- 01:30:16been left for you is if you could go
- 01:30:21back and fix your worst mistake but it
- 01:30:24would change everything afterwards with
- 01:30:27no
- 01:30:28guarantees would you do
- 01:30:32it no I would not do it I think we make
- 01:30:36mistakes in life and we learn from them
- 01:30:39and we adapt and we it can set us off in
- 01:30:43a different direction but that
- 01:30:45ultimately is going to influence who we
- 01:30:47become who we interact with how we build
- 01:30:50a life forward and I wouldn't change my
- 01:30:53life life if I could go back and it
- 01:30:56could would set me on a completely
- 01:30:58different trajectory could you think of
- 01:30:59a worst mistake when I said that did one
- 01:31:01come to mind or was that a category of
- 01:31:03there wasn't I maybe I haven't spent a
- 01:31:06lot of time to try and dive into some of
- 01:31:09my worst mistakes I definitely have made
- 01:31:10mistakes along the way and uh obviously
- 01:31:13would have done some things differently
- 01:31:15in my personal or professional life but
- 01:31:17I do think that that is what has made me
- 01:31:20who I am today right I think I have
- 01:31:21tried to learn from those mistakes
- 01:31:24try not to make them again um and try to
- 01:31:27figure out how to adapt from there but
- 01:31:29that has I think set me on a path that
- 01:31:31uh is where I am today so I wouldn't I
- 01:31:33wouldn't change that it's so interesting
- 01:31:36the subject of sleep for me because I I
- 01:31:38was part of the like burnout Brigade The
- 01:31:41like badge of honor burnout Brigade for
- 01:31:43a long period of time and I I definitely
- 01:31:45thought in my early career when I
- 01:31:47started my first business around 18 19
- 01:31:4920 21 up until probably about I'm going
- 01:31:52to say up until about 26
- 01:31:54I thought that me not sleeping was
- 01:31:57something to show off and I thought that
- 01:31:59I was more impressive if I communicated
- 01:32:02to people how little I slept and how
- 01:32:04much I was able to accomplish in spite
- 01:32:06of that I think actually the greatest en
- 01:32:08enabler to my productivity is like being
- 01:32:10really obsessive about my sleep and
- 01:32:12having that rule that I said where
- 01:32:14nothing in my life unless there's a
- 01:32:16something that's immovable is booked
- 01:32:17before 11 o00 and I really hope other
- 01:32:19people um after listening to you after
- 01:32:24going through your work which is all
- 01:32:25available online really prioritize their
- 01:32:28sleep because as you've shown through
- 01:32:29your research and the studies the the
- 01:32:32impact the very real impact on our lives
- 01:32:35is so profound maybe one shift in your
- 01:32:38mindset too that I encourage you but
- 01:32:40everyone that's listening as well is the
- 01:32:43way I frame it to athletes is it's a
- 01:32:45small tweak but if you think about sleep
- 01:32:48is not the end of today it's the
- 01:32:50beginning of tomorrow what you do to
- 01:32:53prepare
- 01:32:54what you do to try and get the the
- 01:32:55duration that you're striving for and
- 01:32:57how you set yourself up will affect
- 01:33:00everything about how you function how
- 01:33:03you interact with individuals and
- 01:33:05ultimately perform tomorrow if you're
- 01:33:07willing to do everything it takes for
- 01:33:09you to be your best sleep has to be
- 01:33:13foundational in every day and if you're
- 01:33:16willing to put in that time and that
- 01:33:18effort you'll reap the benefits that
- 01:33:19come down the line and it can be
- 01:33:21completely
- 01:33:22lifechanging but you have to give
- 01:33:24yourself that Grace and that patience to
- 01:33:27be able to make these small adjustments
- 01:33:30but as some of my athletes have shown it
- 01:33:32can be a GameChanger for them it can
- 01:33:34completely change the trajectory of
- 01:33:36their career and even life once they
- 01:33:39actually get quality sleep under their
- 01:33:41belt and so I challenge everyone to make
- 01:33:44small adjustments starting tonight and
- 01:33:47reach out if you have questions but
- 01:33:49where do we find you uh you can reach me
- 01:33:52at um Instagram Twitter or x uh Facebook
- 01:33:56um LinkedIn at Dr Sherry ma d r c h r i
- 01:34:02Mah or you can find me my website is Dr
- 01:34:05sherim ma.com thank you so much I I know
- 01:34:09that there's a lot of different
- 01:34:10individuals from various sports teams
- 01:34:12that listen because I speak to them I
- 01:34:13was speaking to um some of the guys at
- 01:34:15Manchester United um two weeks ago in a
- 01:34:18hotel about from the well-being team
- 01:34:20about these subjects and the sort of um
- 01:34:22interconnected subjects of sleep and
- 01:34:24well-being generally but also I've
- 01:34:25spoken to people at Chelsea Football
- 01:34:27Club that listen to the podcast about
- 01:34:28these themes so I'm I'm convinced
- 01:34:31there's going to be a lot of athletes
- 01:34:32and aspiring athletes and just people
- 01:34:34like me who are going to benefit
- 01:34:35profoundly from the work that you do and
- 01:34:37the research that you've you've done
- 01:34:38that really shines the light on the
- 01:34:39importance of sleep which is often
- 01:34:41misunderstood and is seen as a
- 01:34:42negotiable part of our lives so thank
- 01:34:44you so much for the work that you do and
- 01:34:46I'm very excited to see um where your
- 01:34:48research and where your studies take you
- 01:34:50because it will be pioneering research
- 01:34:52No Doubt thank you so much thanks for
- 01:34:55having me it's been a
- 01:34:56pleasure perfect Ted has quite frankly
- 01:34:59taken the nation by storm a small green
- 01:35:02energy drink that you've probably seen
- 01:35:04popping up through a Tesco or to a
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- 01:35:15typical unhealthy energy drinks and
- 01:35:17they've been looking for an alternative
- 01:35:19perfect Ted is the drink that I drink as
- 01:35:21I'm sat here doing the podcast because
- 01:35:23it gives me increased focus it doesn't
- 01:35:26give me crashes which sometimes might
- 01:35:27happen if I'm having a three four five
- 01:35:29six hour conversation with someone on
- 01:35:31the podcast and it tastes amazing it's
- 01:35:33exactly what I've been looking for in
- 01:35:35terms of energy that's why I'm an
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- 01:35:57[Music]
- 01:36:16[Music]
- sleep optimization
- performance improvement
- athlete training
- cognitive function
- nap benefits
- reaction time
- decision-making
- emotional regulation
- sleep debt
- personal sleep needs